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DangleFest89 Posted - 02/13/2009 : 13:36:55
Please give me 10 good reasons why this guy is a good coach for the Oilers I honestly have no idea why you think he is.
24   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
Guest2949 Posted - 02/24/2009 : 10:40:12
i forgot my password, was oiler79. haven't really seen anything to reply too, except this one. Mac T, good coach or bad. As an ex-coach, from novice to junior A, and AAA, there are some things that are in control of the coach, IE,(1) defensive coverage, why are the teams always outshooting the oilers ?.... coach's responsibility.(2) PP, a system that works, if you've ever watched a detroit PP, there is always a guy INFRONT of the net, told to by the COACH. oilers, 3 guys behind the goal line, along the boards. (3) MOTIVATION, you have to bring out the best in players, in how you treat them what you say etc. players are not inspired to play. the more/longer you play on a line with 1-2 people, the more you gel, i don't ever remember gretz not playing with kurri, or messier without anderson. bucky with mac-t.... they made each other good. hemsky has just about played with everyone and no set line mates. there agian, coachs decision. i remember a few years ago, we were what chicago was last year, now today....??? what happend to us. systems do work, look at the sutters, wish anyone of them were coaching the oilers. mact's problems from what i see is, he has no system that works (reason why the oilers went to the cup wasn't because of mact, it was because of the players wanting it more and playing hard to get there), doesn't know how to motivate. it doesn't take talent to play with your heart. it takes talent to bring out that heart. anyway, hope this adds a little lite to this topic. i'm watching and reading, just not posting......... (c) OILER 79, since 79, love my oil
lyall Posted - 02/19/2009 : 09:22:34
IF you look at the lineup for the Falcons 6-3 win, Schremp was on the Top line. But that proves the point even more that he should NOT be in the NHL.

"I Was So Happy I Gave Kerry Fraser A Hug" -Bill Guerin
Guest7913 Posted - 02/19/2009 : 07:55:45
Originally posted by lyall

Just thought I would throw in that Schremp only has 6 goals & is playing on the top line for the Falcons. And seeing how this topic is about coaches, the Falcons are the worst team in the AHL & they just fired their coach. Will they make the playoffs now? No. Are they better? No. Will they get better? Not with a first liner who only has 6 goals.

"I Was So Happy I Gave Kerry Fraser A Hug" -Bill Guerin

Actually Rob Daum bumped Schremp's butt to the 4th line as soon as he came in. And I will guarantee the Falcons will become a better team under him. But it isn't going to happen overnight. Just look at Ottawa. It took a while for their new coach to finally get them winning some games. We will need to ride MacT till the end of the season, and then we need a new coach. I can't handle another year of his "all defensive/non trap/no offensive" system. It doesn't work for these players.
lyall Posted - 02/18/2009 : 22:37:58
Just thought I would throw in that Schremp only has 6 goals & is playing on the top line for the Falcons. And seeing how this topic is about coaches, the Falcons are the worst team in the AHL & they just fired their coach. Will they make the playoffs now? No. Are they better? No. Will they get better? Not with a first liner who only has 6 goals.

"I Was So Happy I Gave Kerry Fraser A Hug" -Bill Guerin
Beans15 Posted - 02/18/2009 : 14:30:04
I am not making excuses, I am laying down my opinion. That opinion is simple. Schremp is not an NHL ready player and that is not MacTavish's fault.

I am not in the Oiler organization, but if he was so damn good, don't you think there would have been offers out there?? If the Oilers are not interested in him do you not think they would have dealt him somewhere if he was to value to any other team??

That's just common sense.

Schremp never was, and I don't ever will be NHL ready. His work ethic was in question before he was drafted.

A Little homework and a little research and all of this is out there to see. I'm not making it up!
DangleFest89 Posted - 02/18/2009 : 13:41:57
I love gags favourite player actually but come on the kid gets a little bump and hes hit off the puck they both have nice hands pp specialist both owned in OHL actually funny Schremp did alot better especially when Gags played with Kane and Kosistyn you listen to the media way too much. but to stop making excusses im done with this. Theres only so much I can say about Schremp yes I do think he WAS nhl ready but now that his work ethic has gone down the drain and hes looking lost of most of the nights(yes i watch ahl games). So where are you in the Oilers Organization to know about all these trades?
Beans15 Posted - 02/18/2009 : 07:38:38
To compate Gagner to Schremp is like comparing a Ford to a Ferarri. Gagner is better(significantly better) at every single thing regarding hockey over Schremp. That's almost embarassing that an "Oilers Fan" would compare those two.

And maybe last year was a fluke, and maybe he is frustrated, but suck it up, buttercup. True, NHL-Level players will find their way to the show. And they will stay hungry, sharp, and productive until that time. Schremp has not done that.

And here's a quick question: If Schremp is so good and he should be in the NHL so badly, why is there not any deals on the table for him?? It's obvious that the Oilers are not giving him the ice, so why don't they trade him???

I'll give you the answer, THEY CAN'T!! No one else wants him either. To be clear, he's not NHL material here or on any other team. He would not even be playing for the Islanders or Leafs.

The fact that Schremp has turned out to be a bust is not MacT's fault.
DangleFest89 Posted - 02/17/2009 : 19:57:57
it motivates beans yes I will get off the Schremp bandwagon when he is given a chance to exceed at the nhl level look at gagner where did he start exactly give the kid a chance and the Fire MacT bandwagon will never leave for me atleast

So last year was a fluke? who wouldn't be frustrated lead the AHL in points and don't get the call and when is finally given the chance he gets 2 points in 2 games then is sent down immediatly. I probably wouldn't start to care about hockey if that was me but hey im no NHLer
Beans15 Posted - 02/17/2009 : 15:11:21
I completely disagree Danglefest. Putting an offensive prospect on the 4th line is about the worst thing you can do for development. It is better for any developing player to be in the minors over getting 4-6 poor quality minutes a game.

And the problems with Schremp are plentiful. He is almost no risk to score (6 goals in 43 AHL games), he is a defensive liability, and he has been cited by every coach he has ever had as having a poor attitude and having no work ethic.

Please, get off the Schremp bandwagon. The sooner that kid leaves the Oilers organization, the happier I will be. At best, he will be a marginal NHLer, and that is after some further development.
DangleFest89 Posted - 02/17/2009 : 13:42:49
Originally posted by lyall

Originally posted by DangleFest89
but still why not use the guy who is a PP specialist a natural center which this team needs.

Umm... With Horcoff, Gagner, Cogliano, Pouliot & Brodziak all natural centers, & Schremp not ready for the NHL, Doesn't seem like a good call up to me. And With Moreau our only true left winger it makes sense to call up people like Reddox over Schremp.

"I Was So Happy I Gave Kerry Fraser A Hug" -Bill Guerin

They all may be natural center but can you say you trust them with the faceoff in the offensive end when down maybe maybe Horc and Brodziak as for MAP Gags and Cogs no. Gags has finally earned center Cogs is doing fine but i like him more on the wing for speed MAP is a dime a dozen prospect 3rd liner at best in his career why not use Schremp who has the potential and can actually play the center position and win faceoffs just saying....never hurt to make him a 4th liner and earn his way up
lyall Posted - 02/17/2009 : 09:46:07
Originally posted by DangleFest89
but still why not use the guy who is a PP specialist a natural center which this team needs.

Umm... With Horcoff, Gagner, Cogliano, Pouliot & Brodziak all natural centers, & Schremp not ready for the NHL, Doesn't seem like a good call up to me. And With Moreau our only true left winger it makes sense to call up people like Reddox over Schremp.

"I Was So Happy I Gave Kerry Fraser A Hug" -Bill Guerin
Guest2559 Posted - 02/17/2009 : 08:32:36
Dangels & Beans I think you both make good points and I am going to have to agree with dangel's that they need a new coach. However I will have to agree with beans that they need to leave it be for the rest of the season. (I really cant see it helping the team now). Beans also says they need 2 legit 1swt line players and how could anyone argue that. Mac T has nt done a terible job and in no way has he doe a good job. He will ride out the year and should get in the playoffs. As long as they dont win a series he is gone Lowe would have no choice if he likes his job. If they make it past the first round he gets till Christmas next year for the team to decide what needs to be done.
DangleFest89 Posted - 02/16/2009 : 17:37:24
better than another Leaf topic ehhh

1. Schremp may not be NHL ready now but why let him rot in the AHL when he can learn in the NHL especially when the Oil were hurting for offence a few months ago with key injuries going to our PP I know MAP and other guys step up but still why not use the guy who is a PP specialist a natural center which this team needs. I still think he played good for when he got called up he didn't get alot ice but when he did he played smart finished his check and set up a nice play. Pretty obvious MacT has favourites.

2. Yes Reddox was hot for a bit and we do struggle for a LW who can finish for hemsky and I can agree it never hurts to try.

3. Calling out to the media can work and not but correct me if i'm wrong Bowman didn't call out kids especially with such a young team the Oilers have some stuff can kill a guy confidence

Towards the system comment yes when it on its on and when its off is it ever off. Just Beans our system changes every year yes I know we have young talented players in the line up but why not stick with a system that you can stick with for more than a year.

To 1st line comment I refer to classic saying "if it ain't broken why fix it"

Yes I respect MacT for making players earn there time when Gags got called up last year and worked his way up from 4th I like to say Bravoh

But for all the Negatives compared to the Positives I still gotta say MacT is a bad coach.

I'd just like to say Beans we may never agree but its nice having another Oiler fan who is passionate about the team.
Porkchop73 Posted - 02/16/2009 : 16:24:42
I am intrigued by this topic.
MacT has a winning record through last season 263-217-47-47.
In the seven full season as head coach he has made it to playoffs three times.
2 first round losses and 1 trip to a cup final.
I am really on the fence as to whether he is a good coach. I think that the problems are that MacT has trouble developing the younger players. The team has changed considerably since that cup final in 05/06 and the system Edmonton used then was more defensive. Now it employs a more speed/transition game that everyone else is trying. I guess if the Oil had been a consistent playoff team over MacT's tenure then he would be considered a good coach. There is an abundance of really good young talent in the Oil system, I personally would have expected a lot more from the coach in getting these players to play to their potential.
Beans15 Posted - 02/16/2009 : 15:21:50
Dangle, perhaps I mis-stated my intentions. I do not argue with any of your points that are fact based. Basically, the statements about the Oilers performance in the past. However, I do not agree with many of your opinion based statements. Here are a few examples:

1) Shremp is not a NHL player. Not yet and maybe not ever. He is horrible defensivly and does limited things offensively at the NHL level. I agree that MacT and the Oilers have not brought him up.

2) Reddox on the first line was not a bad decision. This happens often in the NHL when a player goes down. Most coaches will do their best to not change all of their lines when one player gets injured.

3) I like the fact that MacT is vocal to the media and calls out players. He's not the only coach that does this. In fact, if I recall, Scotty Bowman was known to bring players up to the media that were underperforming.

Now, you say the Oilers do not have a system. You are wrong. Watch the team play. They have a very specific zone style (almost as they are on the penalty kill) in the defensive end. They have a specific breakout philosophy, and they have a specific method on the PP. This all builds up into a system. Like it or not, it is still a system.

You also brought up a statement about Penner-Horcoff-and Hemksy having to be the 1st line and why did it take so long for MacT to figure that out. It's the same reason why Detroit does not play Zetterberg - Datsuyk-Hossa as their regular 1st line. Same reason that Alfredsson-Heatley-Spezza do not play all the time together. Crosby and Malkin, the list goes on and on. It is a common coaching strategy to use your best players through out the line-up to create a spark and to have consistent threats through out the line up when you do not have more than a few skilled players.

The consistancy thing is valid. However, it is not all MacTavish. The players have a responsibility in this as well. Specifically when you look at those "Blow Out" games. That was 100% the players fault. They did not show up. They are the one's playing the game. And considering the win 3 games lose 2 etc, that again is the players as much as it is the coach.

As I stated above, MacT does have a system. It is there and when (I said when) they execute that system for a full 60 minutes, they are a very dangerous team. They have beaten the best of the best in the league at different times through the season. MacT should get his due credit in that. They are 5 games over .500 and MacT should also get his due credit for that. They can skate with anyone when they follow the system. When they fail to execute, they lose. That is the players not the coach. And you can not put all the bad stuff on MacT without giving any credit or praise for any of the good that they have done to this point.

And they still don't have the team top to bottom to skate through a 7 game series against the elite in the league. I don't care if you brought in Scottie Bowman or Al Arbour in their prime, it still would not make an average team as the oiler have able to beat the Detroit's, San Jose's, or Boston's of the world in a 7 games series.

For all I said above, changing the coach today does nothing. Changing the coach in the offseason might be in order, only because it might be time for a change, not because MacT is a bad coach.

This is very much the old addage in sport. When a team is not performing to the standards set by the fans and the management team, you can't fire the team. So who do you fire?? The coach. This would be one of those situations where it's not all the coaches fault be he'll take all of the fall.

DangleFest89 Posted - 02/16/2009 : 13:53:12
To Beans sorry about the comment on Mact but most people forget thats he has done that, and if you agree with everything I say then why keep Mact as a coach its always excusses after excusses and im getting sick of it I honestly have no problem with firing him now we don't even have a system most practices were practice the basics because we are so damn inconsistent!!!!! what is our system tell me honestly defensive if we are why do we get friggin outshot every game atleast 40 shots against some nights where roli has to bail us out. You say its not Mact fault for there play well why the hell are they a playoff team one night where they play a full sixty and then others they play one twenty and give up and sickening and inconsistent. We win 3 games we lose 4 we win 1 we lose 2 we win 5 we lose 3 honestly our whole season has been like that I hate it. saying toskala is same as mact is a decent comparsion but toskala is suppose to stop pucks while MacT make our whole team play well which either isn't doing right now. I disagree again if we do change our coach we can atleast see if it is the team problem with inconsistency or Mact was the problem. He is a bad coach and thats my story and im sticking to it.why is it all the easy decisions that go to any coach seem so hard for him to make Penner Horc Hemsky 1st line honestly how long did it take....

To Lyall
did you read any of the stuff Mact has done this year alone? Well do you think bad mouthing a coach of a team is going to make you look good? Not everyone is as stupid as Avery oh wait I don't think anyone is that stupid to bad mouth a coach unless they want the whole NHL against them and a media uproar. Look at Penner Schremp Garon you think if they say MacT doesn't no anything about hockey its going to make them get more ice time....nope. If he gets fired this off season I'll be happy but it likely won't happened till Lowe is gone as well which sucks.

To Willus
I'm not chirping Penner but MacT used him in dumb roles at the start of the season a 3rd line grinder like honestly 4million for a friggin 3rd line grinder when he lead the team in goals last year also the pk like come on..........He is decent but really slow and soft but hopefully he will mature and become a Bertuzzi like player if not she going to be a long contract in edmonton for him haha. It is true living up to a contract is hard and I hope the best for the kid its gotta be nice playing Hemmer. I don't wanna agree Mact needs 1-2 more years because then if we have a miracleous playoff run he be here for another 8 years:(.

Heres to Pat Quinn or John Tortella for Oilers Coach in 2009/2010 season
Beans15 Posted - 02/16/2009 : 13:38:25
I am eluding to Hemsky being the only top 3 forward on the team. Horcoff, Cole, and Penner are legitimate 2nd line players. Neilsson, Cogliano, and Gagner will be, and they are the best the Oilers have, but they need to contribute at least 1/2 a point a game each to be considered legitimate 2nd line players. They have a combined for 69 points in 149 man games.

Here's the deal, if the Oilers miss the playoffs or make the playoffs but get punted in the first round because they didn't show up, MacT will move on. He will either resign or will be moved to a different spot in the organization. However, it's not due to lack of ability. As Lyall said, it is time to shake things up.

But I stand firm in the stand that the Oilers will continue to be average until some legitimate 1st line talent shows up in town. They might have to sacrifice some players to get there.

Another scaring rumour I heard is that Brentt Sutter in New Jersey is going to resign at the end of the season, win or lose. He misses his family and wants to be closer to them. That family is in Alberta (?)

Imagine the intrigue added to the battle of Alberta if Brentt Sutter is the coach of the Oilers while his brother Daryl is the GM in Calgary???

A guy can dream... I would easily concede that Sutter would be a step up on MacTavish.
leigh Posted - 02/16/2009 : 11:04:22
Bad time to change the coach. I think Therien being fired In PIT was bad timing too considering the team was over 500, but we'll see how that plays out. The players need to take more responsibility than they often do. Also there is no way Lowe would fire MacTavish in the middle of a season. If he ever does it, it will be in the off-season...or maybe they will both be fired at the same time.

I would agree with Dangle that they should have had better results over the last 8 years than they have, it seems like they are always "rebuilding" or "waiting" for their young stars to come of long do the fans have to wait? Perhaps it's not MacT's fault but management's fault? But Edmonton has a recent reputation of not being able to keep or attract maybe it's the mayor's fault? (sarcasm)

As for your comments about Penner Dangle, Penner is a good young player with a bright future, but he's in the smae boat as lot's of the other guys, he's still young! He had a great season for the Ducks and then he was "offered" too much money. He's crumbled under the pressure! He'll need time.

Basically the whole franchise needs more time (1 to 2 years) Keep MacT for that time I say.

Beans. are you eluding to Hemsky being the only legit top 6 player among the forwards?
lyall Posted - 02/16/2009 : 10:26:45
I have to agree with Beans, Dangle you don't really make a valid argument. If watch any pre game interviews from teams playing the Oilers they almost all say that they are a well coached team. And many GM's and coached throughout the league would say that MacT is great coach.
That being said, do I love the guy? No. Would I be upset to see him go? No. But the only reason the Oilers need a change is to mix it up. Wake up the team a bit, New system, new idea. and all that jazz. But as Bean said, now is a bad time to fire your coach(we'll see how PIT does). If we don't make the playoffs this year, he should be gone. But I'm sure that if we do let him go, he will he coaching somewhere in the NHL by the end of next season.

"I Was So Happy I Gave Kerry Fraser A Hug" -Bill Guerin
Beans15 Posted - 02/15/2009 : 07:27:56
FIrstly, Danglefest I deleted the post about MacTavish and his past drinking and driving issue.

Secondly, you are correct in everything you said. I will not argue that the OIlers under MacTavish have not been successful. But you can not pin that solely on him. The Oilers have never had a great team on paper in that time either. The one season they went to the final was the only time in MacT's tenure that they had the players to succeed, and they did. The other seasons could be blamed on the players and the GM as well. It's not all MacT's fault.

This is very much like the arguement that Toskala is the resaon the Leafs are a bad team. It's just not valid.

And changing a coach is not always the answer. Look at Ottawa. Virtually the same team tha went to the finals two years ago and they are out of the playoffs. They changed coaches from Murray to Paddock to Murray to Hartsburg to Clouston. It had done nothing.

As I said above (which I stand by emphatically) changing the coach for the Oilers will do nothing to improve their success until the add legitimate 1st line skill.

DangleFest89 Posted - 02/14/2009 : 10:32:18
Oh yeah forgot to add who is the next defence going to foward?
Lets put Penner on the PK hes so fast and Talented
How long did it honestly take to get the same line that produced last year to get put together this year Penner Horc Hemsky
Lets bash our players to the media cuz I have no other way to motivate them
Lets put Cole on his wrong wing when he cleary says he doesn't feel comfortable there
You say the Oilers are a average team that don't derserve the playoffs yet many and i say many thought Oilers had the division this year not another year of fighting for 8th look at names alright everyone is underachieving who do you blame the coach for never having a freaking gameplan. The only thing he does is on the PP give it to Souray or give it to Hemsky so he can feed Horc with the one timer. Ever notice how every year Mact changes the style of play frig if you want a defensived team then stick with the trap its not hard
....I prob got more i'll add when i remember some
DangleFest89 Posted - 02/14/2009 : 10:25:55
Has only made the playoffs 3 times in his 8 (soon to be 9th) seasons.
Has never won a division title in his 7 years, highest point total was 95.
Only team in the NW division to never get a whiff of the division title (all four teams have a division title)
Has never made the playoffs 2 years in a row, yet missed the playoffs twice in a row in 07-08
Missing playoffs for three striaght 07-08-09 (on pace if we're inconsistent)
Being the only Western Canadian team to lose to the Leafs and Sens (they lost to Cal and Van but got two pts in our own f***ing disgraceful)
Has never had a placing higher then 7th
Schremp isn't even in the NHL...
Injuries...Where is Brule
Made Penner a checker on the third line...nuff said
Said that Marty Reasoner is as good as Sakic....f***ing dumb as hell
9-2, 10-2 and 8-3 blowouts speaks volumes for itself, macT lost the team and the players aren't interested in playing for the guy
Its kinda apperent when you get blown outta the water twice in less than two f***ing weeks...
Went past the first round of the playoffs once in his 8 years as a coach, if u take out the 05-06 season,
Have never started a playoffs series at home.
Did Garon honestly even get a chance as soon as he lost once it seemed all hope was lost, Yes Roli is playing amazing this year but hell after the way Garon played last year could we give the guy a chance
Saying we don't have the Talent this year after the run we had at the end is....
We also added Cole and Lubo big improvements(don't chirp cole he plays his heart out every game)
Saying the Sophomores had a fluke 2nd half yes I half agree but we did see there talent and still think a good coach like PAT QUINN would have them winning games for us
I am not asking for Mact Head now I was asking for before christmas it obvious he will be with the team till lowe is gone :(
By Chance are you Dan Tencer??? lol
Guest8815 Posted - 02/13/2009 : 21:16:54
Dangle you're ridiculous. Keep your opinions and don't call out other members, who is obviously alot more knowledgeable than you are, on an opinion that he has all the right to have. On the subject, MacT is doing a completely respectable job with a Sub-Par, and young developing team. He may not be coach of the year, but he also shouldn't be on the Next To Be Fired list. Edmonton lacks offensive ability, and that's the core reason that they struggle to win night in and night out. So before you pin their troubles on MacT, look at the roster on the ice, cause be honest with yourself, and take off the Copper and Blue glasses, the Oilers are not a playoff worthy team. And that's coming from a lifelong Oiler fan. And don't take this as a shot at Tambelini or pinning the blame on him, but if you want to see Edmonton in the Playoffs. Plain and simple, we need some Top Line talent, and overall offensive ability. But I don't see Oiler Management jumping to that conclusion any time soon, we have eons of youth coming in, and with some development this team will be a force for years to come.
Beans15 Posted - 02/13/2009 : 16:04:10
MacT is a good coach with an average team getting average results. I never said he is a great coach or a bad coach, I said he is not the main issue for the Oilers and that changing the coach would not impact anything this year.

I am not going to go in an list out 10 reasons. I will try to explain my point above and you can agree or disagree.

The Oilers are a slightly above average team at best. I won't go through all the details of why, but most specifically is based on the fact that only 1 of their top 6 forwards would be a top line player on any other team and only 3-4 of their players would actually be 2nd line players. There are many teams in the league today that have higher skill and talent levels on their 3rd line than the Oilers have on their 2nd line. I know that Cogliano(29 pts), Gagner(19 pts), and Nilsson(21 pts) have bright futures, but they are not producing to the standards of 1st or 2nd line players today. That's plain and simple. Their goaltending is slightly above average as well. Roloson is not bad but not great either. He doesn't win many games but also doesn't lose many games. Average. Their defense is the reason I would put them slightly above average. Their top 4 (Vishnovksy, Souray, Grebeshkov, and Gilbert) are more than capable and above average offensive.

All that being said, if the Oilers are an average team, why fire the coach when they are getting average results?? The are 27-23-4. That's slightly better than .500 which matches thier ability. Most team stats will also put them near the middle of the league.

They are producing to their abilitiy. What is MacT doing wrong???

Realistically, any other coach would not have THAT big of an impact. Sure, their might be better coaches out there, but without the skill players to produce, the results will not change that much. Specifically at this time of the year. 27ish games left is the worst time to fire a coach. I would all but promise that a coaching change today would mean no playoffs for the Oilers. A coach coming in now would mean a new system, new style, and new philosophy. That is not something that can be learned and installed in 27 games part way into a season.

NOW, I am not saying that it might be time for a change in the offseason, but not today. And even a new coach in the offseason will not change the team that much. The Oilers are in desparate need of skilled offensive talent. Without that, they will continue to get average results. They need legitimate talent to fill their 1st line and expect the 3 sophmores to not slump next year.

I don't agree that MacT is the reason that an average team is producing average results. If they were 5-10 games under .500 I would agree that he is responsible. However, firing the coach today will not change the results this season.

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