Register | Active Topics | Active Polls | Search
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?
 All Forums
 Eastern Conference -Metropolitan Division
Allow Anonymous Posting forum... Pittsburgh
 HUGE TRADE : BOSTON AND DALLAS Allow Anonymous Users Reply to This Topic...
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  

Go_Habs_Go
Rookie



157 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  12:01:03  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Poll Question:
WHO WON THE SEGUIN VS ERIKSSON TRADE ?

"Bon point Jacques!" - Benoît Brunet

Choices:

Boston ?
Dallas ?

(Anonymous Vote)

Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro



714 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  12:04:58  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
hahaha Lets wait and see what is in place. Other players and assets are in place.

Eriksson is a pretty good player and underated scoring over 70 points in the past three seasons prior to the lockout.

Seguin is 21 and as yet to attain his potential.

It's an interesting trade none the less.
Go to Top of Page

nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3582 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  12:40:14  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Leafs81

hahaha Lets wait and see what is in place. Other players and assets are in place.

Eriksson is a pretty good player and underated scoring over 70 points in the past three seasons prior to the lockout.

Seguin is 21 and as yet to attain his potential.

It's an interesting trade none the less.



Eriksson is not underrated, he is regarded as one of the best 2-way players in the NHL today. Top 6 forward, plays top line PP, top PK minutes, can play physically, capable of 70+ points. I believe he was a finalist for the Selke trophy a few years back. Only 27 years old, one might argue there is still some potential left in him as well.

BOS is deep at centre, so they had some ability to give up on Seguin. Eriksson is a definite upgrade on Horton IMO, so their winger vacancy is now solved.

Good trade all around.

EDIT - I see that there are more peices now. DAL also gets Peverley, while BOS managed to get highly regarded defensive prospect Joe Morrow (DAL acquired him from PIT for Brendan Morrow last season).

I still call this a draw - two teams swapping extras to fulfill other needs.

Edited by - nuxfan on 07/04/2013 12:43:14
Go to Top of Page

Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8174 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  13:14:28  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Agreed Nux. I'm laughing heartily at some of the quick draw posts in other threads about this being an issue with Seguin. He clearly is worth something if Eriksson is the return. Swap value for value. It's like if I have 2 cars and you have 2 trucks, we trade a car for truck and everyone is happy. The value of the car or truck might be a bit more or less but it's close enough.

Dallas got their future #1 centre and Boston got a solid, solid winger.

Ottawa, the best coached team in the NHL, with MVP like players such as Chris Neil, will win the Cup in 2013!


Edited by - Beans15 on 07/04/2013 13:14:46
Go to Top of Page

JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1877 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  13:34:22  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Seguin is 21 and has already had a 67 point season, with tonnes of potential to increase these stats with top 6 minutes, while Eriksson at 27 has only been able to maintain a 70 point pace, while playing more top 6 minutes in the last few years. Last year Seguin from the 3rd line in Boston out scored Eriksson from the top 6 in Dallas. Take out the other parts of this deal, which seem to be a wash and I am thinking Dallas will come out ahead on this trade stats wise, but Boston wins this trade based on the advantage cap wise.

Like Eriksson and think this is a great pickup for Boston. I am now wondering what Seguin had done in Boston to garner his name being dragged in to the newspapers and now traded.

"I now realise that the Toronto Maple Leafs, Canada's finest hockey team, is better than the Ottawa Senators - and always will be. PS - LOVE that Dion Phaneuf! "
Go to Top of Page

The_Gipper
Rookie



Canada
209 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  13:36:29  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Seguin and Jamie Benn are going to be a solid 1-2 punch down the middle in Dallas for a long time.
Go to Top of Page

CrockOShight
Top Prospect



90 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  13:54:42  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I love the trade for Boston. Eriksson is exactly the kind of player who is going to flourish under Claude Julien / playing on a line of Marchand-Bergeron-Eriksson.

I don't understand what Dallas is doing... To me, they seem like the suckers at the table. What does this team want? Are they going for a Cup Run by signing veterans like Whitney, Jagr and Roy? Or, are they rebuilding by trading away Morrow (the elder), Jagr, Eriksson, picking up some prospects in return? I still can't believe that Dallas let Mike Ribeiro and Michael Ryder walk last season. Their top two scorers - just let them walk. And then not making the Playoffs looks bad...

Anyway, Dallas' intentions don't really seem that clear to me here. Nonetheless, they got value for value. Hopefully Seguin lives up to the "potential" that everyone on this site seems to think he's capable of - which, IF HE TURNS OUT AS GOOD AS PHIL KESSEL - well then. ROFL!! We've got something there!

(I'm literally laughing on the floor as I write this...)
Go to Top of Page

JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1877 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  15:27:47  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thinking Dallas had a team culture problem last year. They traded away what looked like there 3 best players last year for what I thought were lessor players and they improved on the ice. Trading Eriksson away, further signals to me coaching and/or management wants a fresh face on this franchise. Seguins is a sellable commodity for this franchise and has more selling power, as far as season tickets sales, than Eriksson did. So in that it makes sense to me.

I don't watch Dallas play much, but a friend who is a fan and watches more Dallas hockey, said to me Eriksson did not play as well last year. His ppg game was down and the play which garnered him Selke consideration, wasn't at the level of previous seasons. If thats true, both teams are trading away players they feel didn't play to the level they are signed for and are hoping new scenery for the player received might spark there play. Next year we can see if this trade requires 15 pages of conversation.

"I now realise that the Toronto Maple Leafs, Canada's finest hockey team, is better than the Ottawa Senators - and always will be. PS - LOVE that Dion Phaneuf! "
Go to Top of Page

nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3582 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  16:46:00  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA

Seguin is 21 and has already had a 67 point season, with tonnes of potential to increase these stats with top 6 minutes, while Eriksson at 27 has only been able to maintain a 70 point pace, while playing more top 6 minutes in the last few years. Last year Seguin from the 3rd line in Boston out scored Eriksson from the top 6 in Dallas. Take out the other parts of this deal, which seem to be a wash and I am thinking Dallas will come out ahead on this trade stats wise, but Boston wins this trade based on the advantage cap wise.




1. Points are not the whole story. Eriksson is a far more complete player than Seguin is - he plays top-6 forward, and plays in every situatoin (PP, EV, PK), and is good enough to be in the running annually for the Selke trophy. Think a Toews or Kesler or Richards, but on the wing - none of those guys are perennial 80pt players either, but all would be upgrades on Seguin.

2. The 3rd line in BOS arguably had more skill than most team's second lines last year. Its not a fair comparison.

3. I don't think the other parts of this deal are a wash at all. Joe Morrow for Rich Peverly? That is a win for BOS no matter what way you slice it.

Edited by - nuxfan on 07/04/2013 16:46:45
Go to Top of Page

JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1877 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  17:09:25  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan

quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA

Seguin is 21 and has already had a 67 point season, with tonnes of potential to increase these stats with top 6 minutes, while Eriksson at 27 has only been able to maintain a 70 point pace, while playing more top 6 minutes in the last few years. Last year Seguin from the 3rd line in Boston out scored Eriksson from the top 6 in Dallas. Take out the other parts of this deal, which seem to be a wash and I am thinking Dallas will come out ahead on this trade stats wise, but Boston wins this trade based on the advantage cap wise.




1. Points are not the whole story. Eriksson is a far more complete player than Seguin is - he plays top-6 forward, and plays in every situatoin (PP, EV, PK), and is good enough to be in the running annually for the Selke trophy. Think a Toews or Kesler or Richards, but on the wing - none of those guys are perennial 80pt players either, but all would be upgrades on Seguin.

2. The 3rd line in BOS arguably had more skill than most team's second lines last year. Its not a fair comparison.

3. I don't think the other parts of this deal are a wash at all. Joe Morrow for Rich Peverly? That is a win for BOS no matter what way you slice it.


I might be wrong, but as Seguin plays in all the situations you mentioned above and is considered to have an good all around game. Eriksson had an off year Selke wise, I am thinking they are of similar quality play wise, with advantage Dallas here with Seguin being a center/winger with a higher stat potential. I am still seeing the Cap advantage Bruins in this scenerio, but am trying to decide if Dallas wins because they got the better player or potential in this scenerio.

Rich Peverly is a decent player as is Joe Morrow, so I don't see a steal here. I'd like to look back on this 20 games in a see if this looks more like a steal for Dallas on Seguin, but for now it does look like a draw.

"I now realise that the Toronto Maple Leafs, Canada's finest hockey team, is better than the Ottawa Senators - and always will be. PS - LOVE that Dion Phaneuf! "
Go to Top of Page

nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3582 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  17:20:05  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA
I might be wrong, but as Seguin plays in all the situations you mentioned above and is considered to have an good all around game. Eriksson had an off year Selke wise, I am thinking they are of similar quality play wise, with advantage Dallas here with Seguin being a center/winger with a higher stat potential. I am still seeing the Cap advantage Bruins in this scenerio, but am trying to decide if Dallas wins because they got the better player or potential in this scenerio.

Rich Peverly is a decent player as is Joe Morrow, so I don't see a steal here. I'd like to look back on this 20 games in a see if this looks more like a steal for Dallas on Seguin, but for now it does look like a draw.

"I now realise that the Toronto Maple Leafs, Canada's finest hockey team, is better than the Ottawa Senators - and always will be. PS - LOVE that Dion Phaneuf! "



Seguin does not play in PK situations, at least according to NHL.com. Eriksson is one of the best PK forwards in the game today.

I'll agree with you that there is potential, down the road, for Seguin to become the better player in the deal. But that is not the case today.

Joe Morrow is currently not playing in the NHL, he's a 20 year old highly touted offensive defenseman - PIT's first round pick a few years back - there is no accurate comparison between the two. However, if you want to tout the potential of Seguin, I would argue that the potential of Morrow is also extremely high - certainly more so than the current of Rich Peverely.
Go to Top of Page

JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1877 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  17:49:42  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I will pay more attention to Joe Morrow, as I honestly don't know much about him. I have watch Peverly play for Atlanta, Nashville and the Bruins. He is a decent player to my recollection, especially when he played in Atlanta. Don't know why he moved on from there, but he played well with Hossa and Kovalchuk. He's got a cup and a cup run.

I found it hard to find stats for penalty kill or any information at all, but I remember seeing Seguin out for a decent amount of penalty killing. I remember Boston coaching saying they were grooming him to be more like Bergeron (Selke candidate) so they threw him out in mostly defensive situations a lot early in his career to round his game. Best I could do was an article from this years playoffs where he talked about a goal he got beat on, on the PK

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=674862

"I now realise that the Toronto Maple Leafs, Canada's finest hockey team, is better than the Ottawa Senators - and always will be. PS - LOVE that Dion Phaneuf! "
Go to Top of Page

nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3582 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  20:59:42  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
according to NHL.com, Seguin played a total of 22 seconds shorthanded.... over the entire season. He played under 2 minutes over a full 82-game season the season before. Eriksson, on the other hand, averages 1:45 SH TOI per game. It could be that Seguin didn't get much time because there was no need on a BOS team that is full of defensive forwards... but suffice to say, Eriksson is one of the best in all situations, and will likely fit in well with BOS.

I only know this about Seguin because I had to look up his SH TOI for an argument in another thread, and was surprised at how little time he gets. I think the "Seguin plays in defensive situations" moniker comes from the fact that he plays on the 3rd line - which is traditionally the "checking line", and often goes up against an opponent's top line. He might get a lot of defensive duties at even strength, but that's harder to measure without watching a lot of BOS games.
Go to Top of Page

Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5791 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  22:45:30  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Very interesting trade indeed. I still like Seguin's potential, but Eriksson is aleady pretty darn good and could improve yet as well! Looks fairly even overall as I do like Morrow as a prospect!!!

COS....Ribeiro and Ryder did not just walk. It's not like they left as UFA's or something as Dallas did get returns for both of them!
Go to Top of Page

just1n
Rookie



245 Posts

Posted - 07/04/2013 :  23:16:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Remember, CrockOShight, that there is a new GM and coach this year. Whatever Niewendiek was trying to do last year is somewhat irrelevant.

Picking up Horcoff is an interesting move. The Stars have a lot of cap space to burn I guess. I watched Horcoff play Junior B and Junior A, hopefully a change of scenery is a good thing for him!
Go to Top of Page

Guest9295
( )

Posted - 07/05/2013 :  03:49:40  Reply with Quote
As a bruins fan I can tell you Seguin does not play the penalty kill. Power play yes. Still not 100% sold on giving up on Seguin after three years. I would be a hypocrite to say that he has no potential after arguing for years on another thread that he does.

I will only give my approval (as a fan) to this trade if thay can also sign a proven winger today or this summer. Alfredson would fit nicely on a second line with Bergeron and Marchand.

Couple that with Krecji, Lucic and Eriksson and that would be as good as any top 6 in the league.
Go to Top of Page

slozo
Moderator



Canada
4583 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2013 :  07:05:19  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Finally, Boston got back what they had been missing since Kessel . . . a true sniper on the wing who has some speed, and brings a dynamic presence. On top of all that, Eriksson is great on the PK (as if Boston needs more of that!) and is a fairly complete player who doesn't shy away from the physical stuff.

Huge win for Boston.

Dallas gets a guy with "potential" . . . and Boston gets a great performer. Seguin has been a periphery player, and wasn't "getting it" with Boston, so they moved him while the return could be very high. And they got a mammoth return here.

Sucks as a Leaf fan, because Boston really solidified one of their tiny weaknesses here, and they are as complete a team as ever. Sigh.

On a positive note, I have Eriksson in my keeper pool, and I think that despite the Boston defensive structure, that Eriksson on a VERY GOOD TEAM will mean his numbers go up slightly.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
Go to Top of Page

Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8174 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2013 :  07:39:38  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I think we have another 'I told you so' moment coming!!!!!! Stay tuned through this season because I think Seguin is going to blow up! Let me explain:

- Many people are talking about Seguin on Boston, specifically about playing in all situations. Does anyone thing that maybe, just maybe it would hard for Seguin to be the man when Boston is FULL of guys who could be Selke nominees every year??

- Seguin had close to a 70pt season playing 3rd fiddle behind Bergeron and Kreiji. What is he going to do with 1st line minutes?

- Seguin was always the fastest guy on his line. How is that going to look with Benn, who is not only a speedy dude but also pretty physical.


Proof will be in the pudding and I am not looking to argue with people what might happen. Just going on record, as I did with Claude Giroux 2 seasons ago, that Seguin will blow up this season. I see 85+ points and Dallas in a playoff position.

Keep that in your back pocket to tell me I was wrong if it doesn;t happen. I think Boston got what they wanted/needed to replace Horton and add scoring to their roster. But I think Dallas got the better player.

Ottawa, the best coached team in the NHL, with MVP like players such as Chris Neil, will win the Cup in 2013!

Go to Top of Page

Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5791 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2013 :  08:35:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Ballsy prediction Beans. While i wouldn't bet money on this coming true, i wouldn't be at all surprised, looking at who he'll likely line up with as well as being on what should be a more offensive team.

In fairness to the Seguin bashers, wasn't his 67 point season mostly played as a top 6? I thought he played wing for the most part on the top 2 lines, no?
Go to Top of Page

nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star



3582 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2013 :  08:36:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

I think we have another 'I told you so' moment coming!!!!!! Stay tuned through this season because I think Seguin is going to blow up! Let me explain:



I agree - first line minutes and PP, playing in an offensively minded system that thrives on speed and physical play, he's going to do well. They are very quietly building a seemingly solid team this year. Seguin playing with the likes of Benn, Cole, Whitney, he's going to get a chance to produce.

Interesting talk out of BOS this morning, regarding the reasons behind the trade. Apparently BOS management was not thrilled with his off-ice activities...
Go to Top of Page

Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8174 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2013 :  08:56:47  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I heard a PILE of rumours about his off-ice activities. Both he and Marchard were known for their partying ways. Similar to Richards/Carter in Philly. It is obvious that Boston thought more of Marchand than Seguin from that respect. A commonly known twitter account made a tweet yesterday that said, "Fathers in Dallas lock up your daughters. Seguin is coming to town."

There were also rumours that Seguin and Julien did not see eye to eye.

None the less, if his talent can speak for itself on the ice, who care how many baby momma's he gots.


Here is another intersting thing about Seguin: did anyone realize he was 6th in the playoffs in shots?? I know he only scored one but getting 70 shots in 16 min/game is pretty impressive. Compare that to guys like Toews, Hossa, Bergeron, and Sharp. They all had around the same shots but played 4-5 more minutes each game.

I'm hoping for a bet on prediction. Seguin will be a beast next season.

Ottawa, the best coached team in the NHL, with MVP like players such as Chris Neil, will win the Cup in 2013!

Go to Top of Page

slozo
Moderator



Canada
4583 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2013 :  09:48:10  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
It's on, Beans - I will totally take you up on a bet . . . but it'll be Seguin/Dallas being part of our usual bet, I think.

As the perennial loser, you get to choose the bet, and if it's fair enough to me, I'll agree to the terms.

I never get tired of winning.

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
Go to Top of Page

CrockOShight
Top Prospect



90 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2013 :  09:55:22  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Did somebody just write: "Finally, Boston got back what they had been missing since Kessel . . . a true sniper on the wing who has some speed, and brings a dynamic presence."

...Meanwhile, on another Forum across town, Phil Kessel was finally getting the respect he deserved...lol.

Anyway, Beans pulls out a "I told ya so" moment calling for 85 points for Seguin in Dallas... Ewww. Boy. That's a bold prediction. Well, I'll take that bet any day of the week. I think that 70 is already asking for a lot.

On the other hand, I do agree with the idea of what Beans is saying here - Seguin with Benn, Whitney should be a very strong line. Seguin should easily be able to outscore himself from last season. The Dallas PP should be strong. Goliogoski will be nice late round pick for deeper Pools...

By the way, if Seguin outscores Kessel this season, can we finally say that Boston "won" the Phil Kessel trade?? Or, would that mean that they "lost" the Kessel trade...?

Go to Top of Page

JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1877 Posts

Posted - 07/05/2013 :  17:32:44  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
By the way, if Seguin outscores Kessel this season, can we finally say that Boston "won" the Phil Kessel trade?? Or, would that mean that they "lost" the Kessel trade...?

Depends on whether you think the player in return for Seguin has any bearing on the results. By my count Eriksson has just under Kessel like numbers and a lower cap hit, Hamilton is still a Bruin and Knight is coming along. Dont see Toronto getting the better end of that one either.

I am going to agree with Bean's here. I would say his ppg should go up and if he continues to progress, like most suppose, going from 67 points in 2011/12 to 70-80 points wont be too much a stretch for Seguin, as he is being positioned as the top line center in Dallas with extremely strong wingers.

The wild card in all this is if he truly is having issues with this conjenital hip problem, which another poster in another thread suggested, was his stats from 2012/13 a true indication of his physical condition.

"I now realise that the Toronto Maple Leafs, Canada's finest hockey team, is better than the Ottawa Senators - and always will be. PS - LOVE that Dion Phaneuf! "
Go to Top of Page

Alex116
PickupHockey Legend



5791 Posts

Posted - 07/06/2013 :  00:49:00  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA
I am going to agree with Bean's here. I would say his ppg should go up and if he continues to progress, like most suppose, going from 67 points in 2011/12 to 70-80 points wont be too much a stretch for Seguin, as he is being positioned as the top line center in Dallas with extremely strong wingers.





Slow down Joshua! "Agreeing with Beans" would mean predicting 85+pts from Seguin, not just " his ppg should go up"!!!

I'll peg him at 70-75pts, anything else is a bonus for Dallas.
Go to Top of Page

The Duke
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1039 Posts

Posted - 07/07/2013 :  02:19:16  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Good trade for both teams, Eriks is a great player.

Im surprised that the Bruins traded Seguin though, isn`t he still just 21 years old ?

Don`t any1 jump all over that comment .....i never once said that Seguin was crap.....lol.....i just said kessel was better

I think Seguin will score 15 goals and finish with approx. 65 points.
Go to Top of Page

Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro



714 Posts

Posted - 07/07/2013 :  08:55:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Seguin will hit 70 points. And Erikson will go down to about 60-65. That's my prediction.

Can't tell who won the trade yet with all the prospects being in place, but it seems like they both did really good for themselves. I would rather have a 21 years old Seguin on my team then a 27 years old Erikson. The only thing is the cap hit is better with Erikson. Man I keep changing my mind on this trade.
Go to Top of Page
  Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
 New Topic  New Poll New Poll
 Reply to Topic
Jump To:
Snitz Forums 2000 Go To Top Of Page