| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| willus3 |
Posted - 03/27/2011 : 16:18:31
Anyone else thinking it is a particularly weak year for award nominees?
No one is standing out this year and the one guy who was head and shoulders above has been injured for too long to be considered.
It seems to me to be a weak year for the following:
Art Ross
Richard
Norris
Hart
possibly even Selke
Thoughts? |
| 21 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Alex116 |
Posted - 03/29/2011 : 22:35:28
Funny thing is, if there was an award for best season by a guy 40+ years in age, it'd be close between Selanne and Lidstrom! However, personally, i'd give the nod to Teemu! |
| Guest4278 |
Posted - 03/29/2011 : 20:18:30
quote:
Originally posted by Alex116
Guest 4278.....
Before i say what i'm about to say, please realize, Weber would be in my top 3 (not sure i'd have him as my pick or not, but def top 3). I don't for a second think that Ehrhoff is Norris worthy. Yes, he's having a terrific year, but i'd have him around 5-7th if i were picking.
BUT, to say that Weber is leading his team in points is a terrible argument. First, Erat is tied with him in 16 fewer games! The immortal S. Kostitsyn is just 3 back in 5 less games! Sergei Freakin' Kostitsyn? Legwand just 5 back in 18 less games! Even his fellow dman R. Suter isn't all that far back and has played less! What i'm trying to say is, it's not like he's doing some sort of Bobby Orr impersonation and leading his team in points! Second, this goes to show just how defensive this team is.
I was just trying to make sense of the stat posted. To compare Erhoff stats directly with that of Weber does not take into the role the player has on the team. You've proven my point even more by listing players who are offensive leaders on Nashville vs those on Van. I think Luongo has more point (goals and assists) than the 6th leading scorer on Nashville.
So for Weber to do what he is doing on that team with the stats that he has is amazing. Better than Erhoff's inflated stats.
Personally I think Lidstrom is going to win the Norris based on name recognition and well he is 40 years old with 60+ points. That's pretty special. Can we somehow get Teemu on an award too? Wouldn't that be something, two 40yr old guys winning awards in a game that is supposedly for young kids. Amazing. |
| Guest9838 |
Posted - 03/29/2011 : 10:16:13
If you want to talk goalies, how about Bryzgalov in Phoenix, have you looked at that line up. On paper at least they're much weaker than Montreal and yet there they are 4th in the West with 93 pts. Very quietly I might add.
He'll get no love at all though playing out in the desert. |
| n/a |
Posted - 03/29/2011 : 04:58:57
Yep - well said, definitely a weak year for the top forwards. I would say the defensive awards are weak only because of the parity of many of the players at that position . . . no one really stands out.
Ovechkin a very off year. Crosby on a great MVP pace, then injured halfway through. Stamkos on a great goal scoring pace, then basically disappears. Both Sedins having a great year, Daniel better, but Kesler almost good enough to be in conversation as well really. Perry has now surged to muddle things up.
For me, the true MVP is Price on Montreal - without him, they are a crappy non-playoff team.
Letang is my top defenceman pick, phenomenal season and that is with his stats taking a huge hit on a team missing Crosby and Malkin. I really hope they don't give it to Lidstrom, but it really looks that way . . .
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
| Alex116 |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 20:47:45
Guest 4278.....
Before i say what i'm about to say, please realize, Weber would be in my top 3 (not sure i'd have him as my pick or not, but def top 3). I don't for a second think that Ehrhoff is Norris worthy. Yes, he's having a terrific year, but i'd have him around 5-7th if i were picking.
BUT, to say that Weber is leading his team in points is a terrible argument. First, Erat is tied with him in 16 fewer games! The immortal S. Kostitsyn is just 3 back in 5 less games! Sergei Freakin' Kostitsyn? Legwand just 5 back in 18 less games! Even his fellow dman R. Suter isn't all that far back and has played less! What i'm trying to say is, it's not like he's doing some sort of Bobby Orr impersonation and leading his team in points! Second, this goes to show just how defensive this team is. Trotz prob tells his team if they get a 3 on 1 to have one guy bail out and return to the neutral zone leaving them with a 2 on 1! Hey, it's a 2 on 1, still pretty good!
You prob get the point i'm making. He's on a very defensive team which plays a very defensive system, gets a ton of ice time in all situations and is an overall great defenseman. Def in the mix for the Norris, but not because he's leading his team in points!
I see Ehrhoff as a steady defenseman (defensively) but not a standout. I see a pp specialist of sorts, something the Canucks have been desperate for for years! He's (Ehrhoff) having a excellent season, and while i don't get to see Weber a ton, i do hear a lot of talk by the so called "experts" about just how much he means to Nashville and the success they're having. |
| nuxfan |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 19:15:42
quote:
Um lead his team in points. Erhoff's points and effectiveness on the PP and PK is not due to him alone. There are these two guys that look alike on Vancouver that are pretty good at scoring goals - can't remember their name though. Something about last year's Art Ross and this years Art Ross.
The fact that Ehrhoff plays for a good team should not detract from his contribution to that good team - I hear this all the time whenever VAN players are brought up for individual awards, "VAN is a strong team already". At some point, you have to recognize that the individuals on that team do contribute to the overall strength. Is the Vancouver PP as good as it is without his presence on the blue line? Is the PK as effective without him there? Hard to say, but certainly hard to detract from his contributions to the very good team they have. |
| Guest5289 |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 19:09:39
barry trotz has to win the jack adams. His forwards are s*** |
| Guest4278 |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 18:32:51
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
Ehrhoff:
- 6th in points amongst defensemen
- top 20 in +/-, TOI (over 24 minutes a game)
- plays as top pair dman on both PK and PP, which are both currently top-3 in the NHL.
- plays as regular top-2 pairing
Weber:
- 9th in points (1 point back of Ehrhoff)
- not top 20 in +/-
- 3rd in TOI (1 minute more than Ehrhoff)
- I would guess top pair dman on both PK and PP, however neither is top-3 in the NHL
What has Weber done that Ehrhoff has not?
Um lead his team in points. Erhoff's points and effectiveness on the PP and PK is not due to him alone. There are these two guys that look alike on Vancouver that are pretty good at scoring goals - can't remember their name though. Something about last year's Art Ross and this years Art Ross.
Also Vancouver has this no-name goalie with 35 wins. When his back up Schneider is winning ridiculous amounts of game, you really need to ask is it the team or the individual?
Oh I forgot to mention they had one of the best face off guy who is injured and a Selke nominated guy on the PK. No you are right, the team is centered around Erhoff. He is the end all and be all of the Canucks.
Now take a look at the superstars of Nashville with offensive threats like Legwand and .... Right. Offensive juggernaut. Their goalie is as good as Vancouver and their PK is lead by umm, umm.... See the difference between Erhoff and Weber? Somehow Weber is managing the that he does with the supporting cast that he has. That is much more amazing than what Erhoff is doing.
Not denying Erhoff is having a great season but Weber is having a much better season. |
| nuxfan |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 16:51:39
quote:
I have always considered Ehrhoff one of the best in the league, but he did not bring enough to the table this year in my opinion.
If you wan't to give the trophy to the guy who deserves it the most it would be Weber. But since points are so important it will be Lindstrom. (I mean Shane O'Brian)
Ehrhoff:
- 6th in points amongst defensemen
- top 20 in +/-, TOI (over 24 minutes a game)
- plays as top pair dman on both PK and PP, which are both currently top-3 in the NHL.
- plays as regular top-2 pairing
Weber:
- 9th in points (1 point back of Ehrhoff)
- not top 20 in +/-
- 3rd in TOI (1 minute more than Ehrhoff)
- I would guess top pair dman on both PK and PP, however neither is top-3 in the NHL
What has Weber done that Ehrhoff has not? |
| Utemin |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 16:19:49
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
I'm actually surprised that Ehrhoff hasn't gotten more consideration for the Norris trophy...all I hear is Yandle Yandle Yandle, but I think Ehrhoff is at least as deserving as Yandle.
I agree though, this will be one of the weakest offensive years since 2002. Daniel might be the only 100pt player, and its still possible that he might not make it.
Yet, it doesn't feel like there have been less goals scored than in previous years...have there been less goals, or are we just seeing more balanced scoring among teams?
I have always considered Ehrhoff one of the best in the league, but he did not bring enough to the table this year in my opinion.
If you wan't to give the trophy to the guy who deserves it the most it would be Weber. But since points are so important it will be Lindstrom. (I mean Shane O'Brian)
Don't hate me because i'm Beautiful |
| Guest4178 |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 09:26:44
I agree Willus – a weak year for trophy winners.
You caused me to think about trophy winners (and in particular, the Art Ross Trophy), and in this regard, I have posted something under the heading "Are Art Ross Dynasties Dead," because I think it will be a long time before we see a player win this award multiple times (i.e. 3 - 4 times in 10 seasons) with the current crop of players. |
| doublechamp7 |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 09:06:18
Personally, I wont remember this season for what is was statistically, but what it could have been for one player (Damn you Steckel). The only really deep award as Alex said is the Calder.
Bring back the Jets! |
| Alex116 |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 08:16:45
I can't see Daniel not winning the Art Ross and with likely just over 100 points, yawn.
The Richard, i'm still thinking it's going to Stamkos. Yeah, he's been very quiet, but he's one of those guys who will pop in 2 goals in back to back games. Don't think he's got a shot at the Hart anymore unless perhaps he catches fire and can get to 50? There's a chance in fact that if he doesn't win the Richard at the very least that he may not even end up on the ballot!
The Norris is a tricky one. Yandle has really slowed and has just 6 points in his last 16 games. Perhaps points are everything with this award, but when it's your strong suit, you can't dry up like that at this time of year and still win! With more goals, points AND a better +/- than Yandle, i expect Visnovsky to be in the mix, BUT, i think it's actually going to be Shea Weber winning the award this year. BTW, i have a feeling that Lidstrom will be on the ballot, leaving Yandle out completely. I mean, can they really leave Lidstrom out of the running? After all, he pretty much owns the thing!
Vezina. Tim Thomas over Lundqvist and Price. I think Rinne will get some mention, but i think he'll miss out on the ballot mostly because of the many who expected Price to completely flop! I think his play will at least have him in the running.
Hart. Toughest one to predict. I'm going to go with recent history and say Daniel Sedin. There just isn't any standout guy this season.
Jack Adams.....there's been a lot of talk around here about Vigneault winning this considering the amount of injuries the team has had whilst setting many club records for success but Dan Bylsma is going to be tough to overlook. I see it being between those two. Sure, the Canucks have the top 2 scorers and a backup with a crazy good record, but to do all this with so many injuries, especially key guys on the back end, is pretty impressive. I heard somewhere that Vancouver had dress 39 different players this season. That's a pretty crazy number when you consider there's only 19 or 20 dressed a game! AV def deserves some credit for the success of this team regardless of who's on it and playing well!
Selke, i think it's Kesler's year but it could be close. Toews has been outstanding and may steel it due to his second half surge but i still think it's one of those awards that guys tend to win eventually when they've been nominated in the past without winning it.
Calder might be the tightest race of them all! My ballot:
Couture (SJ) 30G 23A 53PTS +19
Skinner (Car) 26G 28A 54PTS -1
Grabner (NYI) 31G 17A 48PTS +16 (on NYI ????)
Looking at the numbers, i think Couture may swipe this away from Skinner in the end. I swear, the guy who engraves this thing prob already scratched Skinner's name onto it back around mid Jan!
Surely at least one of my predictions here will be correct. 
|
| Mario 66 |
Posted - 03/28/2011 : 06:55:36
Lundqvist will win the Vezina because his play of late & Price & Thomas will lose because of their last 8 games, even though Price is not at fault for the habs recent goal defiencies.
Alain Vigneault is a honourable mention for coach of the yr simply do to Vancouver's success, but when your back up goalie is 15 - 2 -3 & you have players 1 and 2 in the scoring race I am sure his coaching performance will be overlooked even though it shouldn't be. If not A.V then I think Bylsma would be the other run away for the Jack Adams, Half the season without top two goal scorers, other half without best defensive forward, 15 - 20 game stretch with a bonified AHL team, & still a top 3 pk unit & within reach of the Flyers & Caps for 1st overall in the East.
Corey Perry will be the lone player to reach 50 goals and run-a-way with the Rocket the last two weeks of the season.
D Sedin will win Art Ross & Hart while Stamkos will win nothing as the last two+ months he has been absolutely anaemic. The norris is a toss up, but if i where to choose over the last month since he joined the Stars Alex Goligoski even though he won't be on the ballet.
In youth we learn; in age we understand |
| nuxfan |
Posted - 03/27/2011 : 21:58:34
I'm actually surprised that Ehrhoff hasn't gotten more consideration for the Norris trophy...all I hear is Yandle Yandle Yandle, but I think Ehrhoff is at least as deserving as Yandle.
I agree though, this will be one of the weakest offensive years since 2002. Daniel might be the only 100pt player, and its still possible that he might not make it.
Yet, it doesn't feel like there have been less goals scored than in previous years...have there been less goals, or are we just seeing more balanced scoring among teams? |
| Utemin |
Posted - 03/27/2011 : 21:50:03
O wait I got it all wrong Shane O'Brian wins it all.
Don't hate me because i'm Beautiful |
| Beans15 |
Posted - 03/27/2011 : 20:58:19
Yandle?? Why?? Because he scores a lot?? Maybe the best defense award should go to a good defensive player???
I completely agree Willus. Very anticlimactic in general. There is nothing from this season that I will remember save the head shots/injuries. I don't recall a single meanful record or streak and athough the Sedins are having a fine season, I would suggest this season will be one with the fewest 100 point players and 40 goal scorers. Geez, how many guys are even on pace for 80 points???
Pretty pedestrian season overall. Hopefully the playoffs are better and give us something to remember. |
| ryan93 |
Posted - 03/27/2011 : 20:31:00
A month ago Steven Stamkos would of been my pick for the Hart, but i don't think that's the case anymore. As far as forwards winning the award go, they tend to lean so heavily on the offensive statistics. With Stamkos falling to 4th in points & 2nd in goals, i just don't see him winning it now...unless he has a very strong 6 or 7 games to finish the season & at least finds a way to win the Richard.
I would love to see Henrik Lundqvist finally win a Vezina as i really think he deserves it. But i'm sure Bruins fans would say the same for Thomas, as would Preds fans for Rinne, Habs fans for Price, Pens fans for Fleury, etc. I see 3 of Thomas, Lundqvist, Rinne, Price being nominated...with Tim Thomas winning for the 2nd time in 3 years.
Jack Adams...again perhaps i'm biased, but i would love to see John Tortorella at least get a little bit of consideration for the award. At one point this season the Rangers were missing 8 of their regular forwards, including something riducouls like 6 of their top 9. Torts managed to get the entire team to buy into the system, and this is as tight & hardworking Rangers team that i can recall.
Art Ross: Daniel Sedin
Richard: Steven Stamkos, although i have a feeling it'll be another tie (Perry)
Hart: Daniel Sedin
Norris: Nick Lidstrom
Selke: Ryan Kesler (followed closely by J.Toews)
Vezina: Tim Thomas
Adams: Dan Byslma (no Crosby/Malkin, yet amazinly only 2 points behind Philly for 1st)
|
| Utemin |
Posted - 03/27/2011 : 18:12:44
No the Nominees will not be weak.
Art Ross- D,Sedin (strong top 5 nothing behind)
Richard-Perry (very weak)
Hart-T.Thomas or D.Sedin (strong section)
Norris- Lindstrom (weak win)
Selke-Kesler (regular)
Vezina-Thomas (stacked!)
Don't hate me because i'm Beautiful |
| Awesome One |
Posted - 03/27/2011 : 17:14:56
Art Ross: Henrik Sedin
Richard: Stamkos
Norris: nominees: Yandle, Lidstrom, Letang winner: Yandle
Selke: nominees: Datsyuk, Toews, Kesler winner: Kesler
Vezina: nominees: Hiller, Thomas, Lundqvist winner: Thomas
Jack Adams: nominees: Vigneault, Boucher, Laviolette winner: Boucher
Hart: nominees: H.Sedin, D.Sedin, Stamkos winner: Stamkos
Yes, a little weaker than usual (notice the lack of Crosby, Ovechkin).
There was once a license plate in Toronto that abbreviated "Go Leafs" it read "Golfs". |
| Mario 66 |
Posted - 03/27/2011 : 16:22:57
Art Ross - Sedin
Richard - Corey Perry 
Norris - ??? (Yandle)
Hart - Sedin
Selke - Kesler
Jack Adams - Dan Bylsma
Vezina - Lundqvist
In youth we learn; in age we understand |
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