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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
 Posted - 10/18/2010 : 14:12:08
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It appears the NHL's voice on headshots was not being heard very well so they sent a loud and clear message.
Not only is Shane Doan known as one of the 'good guys' in hockey but he also plays to a relatively low penalty rate. In over 1000 NHL games he has 960 PIM's and he had just 41 PIM's last season. He is not known to be dirty and I don't believe he has been suspended in the past. Furthermore, the player he hit (Sexton) was not hurt and continued to play through to the end of the game.
Doan received a 3 game suspension as explained in the TSN story below.
What do you think?? Is the NHL getting serious about headshots???
http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=337851
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Edited by - Beans15 on 10/18/2010 14:12:34
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 14:16:31
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Good as long as the hit was dirty it is about time the league starts looking at the hit as the punishable offence and not the injury or effect on the victim. I havn`t seen the hit yet so i can`t say if i feel it was justified but by suspending a player of Shane Doan;s reputation it sends the right message. The only down side is Doan is by far one of my favorite players and its too bad it turned out to be him!
Pasty |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 14:27:27
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgaxOAGcM6w
just saw the hit that should be 10 games,, the puck was long long long gone! wow what a dirty play, their was clear intent there! Sometimes a dirty hit happens because of how quick the game is a player is lineing another up and intensity takes over and a bad hit with no real intent happens... It looks to me like Doan lines up Sexton after the puck is gone,, To me Sexton did something to piss Doan off and this payback because this is not a hockey play this is a intentional dirty hit!
Pasty |
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The Duke
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1239 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 15:01:42
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| Never seen the Doan hit but it seems to me that a lot of the headshots ( not all by any means ) are caused by size diffrential in players. Sure most are elbow to head but some of these huge players elbows are head height to some players even if their elbow is not raised. We are seeing players now @ 6`6``, 6`7``, and taller....compared to some @ 5`10`` and 5` 11``, somethings gotta give. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 17:24:23
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First of all, 10 games Pasty?? Wow, remind me not to put you in charge of discipline of anything. Really, a guy who has never been suspended before who absolutely laid a dangerous hit and deserves a punishment does not deserve 10 games.
Duke, size is rarely an issue. If it was, Chara would be suspended every other game. Specifically in this case, my homie from Halkirk is 6'1" while Mr. Sexton is just 3" shorter.
In the vast, vast, vast majority of the cases the issue is one player being vulnerable while the other comes from the blindside and strikes shoulder to head. Rarely is the issue of height nor elbows. Of the 606 skaters who have played this season, less than 1% of the players(36) are listed as taller than 6'4" and less than 1% of the players(47) are listed as shorter than 5'10".
If more than 98% of the NHL are 5'10" to 6'4", the difference in size is more than likely not the issue. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 18:05:46
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Patsy, I don't think 10 games would be warranted here. The hit was wrong, but relatively minor - I think that is as dirty as Doan gets, and he probably apologized as Sexton hit the ice. Doan is not a dirty player, and AFAIK this is his first suspension.
One can only figure that this does send a message though. If this hit was 3 games - and in the world of injuring headshots, this one seems pretty minor - it will definitely set a baseline for future suspensions. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 18:47:04
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Well, I have seen the hit, and . . . my thoughts are, that the NHL and Colin Campbell are crazy. Seriously.
I thought this hit deserved a punishment WELL BELOW the other punishable offences that have already happened in this young season, and it sure does send out a clear message:
Be confused. 
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 18:47:33
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quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
Patsy, I don't think 10 games would be warranted here. The hit was wrong, but relatively minor - I think that is as dirty as Doan gets, and he probably apologized as Sexton hit the ice. Doan is not a dirty player, and AFAIK this is his first suspension.
One can only figure that this does send a message though. If this hit was 3 games - and in the world of injuring headshots, this one seems pretty minor - it will definitely set a baseline for future suspensions.
James Winiewski got 10 games or maybe it was 8, last year for his hit on Seabrook. this one was ten times worse. Come on count in your head how long the puck is off Sexton`s stick, Doan hasn`t even started the motion of the hit untill well after the puck is long gone! It is nowhere near the same as the Cook and Richards hit that were done at full speed and only a fraction of a second after the puck is gone,, and could be argued that richards and cook were `finishing their check` my point is Doan is not finishing his check he hasn`t even started it yet and the puck is long gone, Ten games easy, i`m sorry we have to send a message, Marc Savard may never play hockey again because of one of these hits, Ask Keith Primeau how many games he should have gotten. This is a guys head at the speed this games is played at the strength these players have develloped it is not for nothing the NHL is implementing new rules. It s simple you send a message this is a first time offender known to be a class act and ambassader of the NHL you hand him 10 games for this and what does that tell the Ruutu`s the Lapierre`s and the Cook`s of the NHL, It tells thim if you do this you get 20 games! I for one am tired of these kinds of plays so lets not tolerate it anymore.
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 18:52:44
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stop the link i posted above at the 9 second mark,, sleane is almost at the Yotes blue line with the puck and Doan is well behind the redline throwing this check come on!
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Guest5806
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Posted - 10/18/2010 : 21:52:14
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| I 'm not sure why gilbert was fined, he realy just collided with stajan |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 22:36:19
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Re-watch the Wisniewski-on-Seabrook hit. Wisniewski takes a run at Seabrook from the CHI blue line, hits him high in the head at a dangerous distance from the boards, and puts his head into the boards, and looks to knock him out cold - I don't think Doan's hit is "10 times worse" than that hit.
Patsy, I agree that the hit is suspend-able, in that there is no question. It was a late hit to the head, suspension handed out, done.
However, regardless what suspensions have been handed out in the past, this suspension does send a new and welcome message for the future. A pretty minor (minor in the world of cheap head shots that is) open ice head shot from a generally classy player nets 3 games. I think this suspension puts the Ruutu's and Cooke's on notice, and it should. |
Edited by - nuxfan on 10/18/2010 22:36:54 |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2010 : 23:38:28
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Gotta agree with Pasty (not Patsy) on this one....well, sorta. While i don't think it warrants a 10 game "vacaction", i do think it's pretty freakin' bad!
First off, i love Doan as a player and agree that this is very out of character from most of what i've seen from him in the past! Regardless, this hit was recklessly late! IMO, it's later and more reckless/dangerous than the Cooke on Savard hit! Here's the issue though. Sexton was ok. Imagine for a second if this were someone with a reputation hitting a star? Simply put, it shouldn't make a difference, but it certainly would! Okay, okay, i know you all want an example now.....let's say Steve Downie on Jarome Iginla? Think about it........ Betcha the suspension is closer to 10 than it is 3? |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 10/19/2010 : 08:55:57
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almost certainly the league takes into account the history of the offender and the seriousness of the injury to the offended in any suspension decision. Or at least they should.
If someone with a history of violence had done this (Downie is a good example), this suspension would have likely be longer - 5 games maybe? If Sexton had been injured on the play, Doan likely would have gotten more games. |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 10/19/2010 : 09:07:34
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| Wether or not the player skates away or gets carried off, the NHL needs to send a message that neither will be tolerated. Just because you skate away doesn't lessen the intent. And who you are should be irrelevant, in a perfect world. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 10/19/2010 : 09:42:23
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It is a bad hit and no one is disputing that. However, how far away puck is has little to do with the suspension. The issue pure and simple is the style of hit that occured. If this is a square and clean bodycheck, this is at worst a 2 minute interference penalty, right??
Ultimately, what I see from this is Doan skated to Sexton and lifted his shoulder in Sexton's head. How far away the puck is really doesn't change anything. |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 10/19/2010 : 10:59:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
It is a bad hit and no one is disputing that. However, how far away puck is has little to do with the suspension. The issue pure and simple is the style of hit that occured. If this is a square and clean bodycheck, this is at worst a 2 minute interference penalty, right??
Ultimately, what I see from this is Doan skated to Sexton and lifted his shoulder in Sexton's head. How far away the puck is really doesn't change anything.
Are you kidding Beans how far away the puck is is everything! Why were Richards and Cook not suspended? Because the puck had just left the stick of Savard/ Booth and before these new rules it was a clean hit. Argue anyway you want what Richards and Cook did was Clean because of the rules at the time. The Doan hit is dirty even before these new rules. Why, because Sexton is clearly no longer in posseion of the puck.... hell he is not even in the play he probably was going to the bench for a change. Now add the new rules on head shots this is a terrible terrible play. The distance of the hit from the puck is important because it is not even a hockey play there is no reason and no way to justify it. Its not like finishing your check its not lake chaseing an iced puck to the corner and one player makes a dangerous shove and the other goes head first into the boards. These are three game suspensions because you can argue its a players intensity that got out of hand chaseing the puck. Doan does this well behind the play to a player woth zero chance of getting the puck back and helping out on the play that is long gone there is no way to argue the intent it was obvious!
Pasty |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 10/19/2010 : 12:23:15
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quote:
Wether or not the player skates away or gets carried off, the NHL needs to send a message that neither will be tolerated. Just because you skate away doesn't lessen the intent. And who you are should be irrelevant, in a perfect world.
1. seriousness of resulting injury does come into play - hits that cause more damage to a player should be treated more harshly. If Doan had missed Sexton entirely with his shoulder, there would be no incident to talk about - even though Doan would still have had all the intent in the world. Conversely, had Sexton gone into the boards and gotten a concussion, or hit the ice hard/awkwardly and been out for a bit, I think the suspension might have been longer, even though Doan probably didn't intend that level of hurt.
2. Your name does not matter. Your history with the league does (or should). Players with a history of discipline and/or suspensions for injurious plays should be treated more harshly than those that do not. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 10/19/2010 : 12:39:32
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Pasty, the reason(and the only reason) the players you mentioned were not penalized was only because there was no headshot rule in place at the time. Nothing in the rules states anything about where the puck is or is not. It was a late hit, absolutely, however this hit does not get penalized with a suspension if the hit was not illegal. That is my point.
"a lateral, back-pressure or blind-side hit to an opponent where the head is targeted and/or the principal point of contact."
It doesn't say anything about a late hit or where the puck is. The location of the puck is irrelevant to this call. That being said, I can appreciate that a player without the puck is not supposed to be hit so they are in a more vulnerable position, however it does not change the call. I agree that the NHL more than likely went for a suspension based on it being a late hit as well. If it was not a late hit it can be assumed he would have been fined like Gilbert in Edmonton and his hit on Stajan.
As I said in my last post, what is the penalty on this play if Doan hits him on the shoulder and from the side(meaning totally legal)???? Is there a penalty more than interference??? |
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Guest5806
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Posted - 10/21/2010 : 22:12:43
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it wasn't a head a shot I'll tell you why...
He didn't hit hit his head, shhhh... |
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Shane Doan Suspended 
