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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
 Posted - 06/17/2010 : 12:12:20
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http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=324934 jaroslave Halak has been traded to the st louis blues still no word on what the return but it better be good or this habs fan will be pissed!
Pasty
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 12:25:55
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apparently its in exchange for Lars Eller and Shultz but im still waiting on details
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fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 12:33:37
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I clicked the link and the story stated;
"In return, the Habs receive defenceman Lars Eller and forward Ian Schultz."
You probably should get pissed!
Good thing Carey Price plays as well under pressure as he does , as this trade only puts more on him,the Habs got nothing solid in return and basically said who needs Halak, we've got Price.....yikes!
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 13:01:36
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What do you expect for a goalie who really was hot for 2 months (Olympics and Playoffs), has only around 100 NHL games and was an RFA???
What would a deal like a 1st Round (Top 15 pick) and a 3rd round for Halak sound???
Pretty Effen good, hey??
That's exactly what this deal was. 2 forwards, both over 6' tall, one coming off a AHL all star campain and the other coming off a pretty solid WHL season with the Hitmen.
What was the expectation for Halak?? I personally think this is a great deal for Montreal. No more goalie controversy, 2 players still on entry level deals, 2 forwards(including a 13th overall pick in 07)???
We will now see what Halak is worth playing on a far less defensive team and not nearly as well coached.
I smell a Christobal Huet type season or 2 to come. |
Edited by - Beans15 on 06/17/2010 13:13:16 |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 13:23:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
What do you expect for a goalie who really was hot for 2 months (Olympics and Playoffs), has only around 100 NHL games and was an RFA???
What would a deal like a 1st Round (Top 15 pick) and a 3rd round for Halak sound???
Pretty Effen good, hey??
That's exactly what this deal was. 2 forwards, both over 6' tall, one coming off a AHL all star campain and the other coming off a pretty solid WHL season with the Hitmen.
What was the expectation for Halak?? I personally think this is a great deal for Montreal. No more goalie controversy, 2 players still on entry level deals, 2 forwards(including a 13th overall pick in 07)???
We will now see what Halak is worth playing on a far less defensive team and not nearly as well coached.
I smell a Christobal Huet type season or 2 to come.
you're right beans this actually works for me as i stated before there is nothing really in the FA market to improve the habs this year and well Lars is much more than a top 15 draft pick hes a top 15 draft pick that wasn't very far off a point per game as a rookie in the AHL if im not mistaken plaus what have the habs needed forever size down the middle what is Lars Eller ? over 6 ft and a canterman,,, no this isn't a bad trade,, Eller isn't like Pouliot, a former 1rst round pick that lost his way this is a young kid right on schedule and coming to the habs and being thrown in as a top six center right away may be just what he needs
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 13:50:53
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this trade is impossible to judge now - a goalie coming off a hot year with no history of hot years for 2 propsects, one of which has never played an NHL game.
This thread should be revisited in 3 years time, then we'll know who won this trade.
Halak is an upgrade in goal, although I'm not sure how much, Mason was fairly solid. They have a lot of young talent already, so they obviously felt they could part with two recent draft picks. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 15:12:09
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Who can tell with trades, I am still in shock over this one . . . I can only imagine Gainey is still pulling the strings behind the scenes (as seen in the press box throughout the playoffs) and that his stubborness over his prized first round pick prevailed here.
What a terrible deal and decision for Montreal is all I could think . . . I am pleased as punch! 
I think you are out in left field on this one, Beans and Pasty. Crackers, in fact. Cuckoo. You get the picture.
Here we had a goalie who played himself into the starters position by mid season and was the defacto starter for the last two months. He has a stellar record, top save percentage and GAA - that's regular season. Then, he plays MVP on a very middling team and upsets not only the juggernaut Capitals in a thrilling come from behind 7 games, but he proceeds to knock off the defending champs and totally outplays Fleury. (did I mention he squeezed in a short Olympic turn and was stellar there as well?)
This all happens, and the Canadiens, who started Price once in the playoffs (that didn't turn out well) and who couldn't trust him to start the last months of the season after getting booed off the ice several times in Feb/March, HE becomes your starter and Halak is traded away for two guys who may or may not be solid NHLers.
I await some kind of creative rebuttal with bated breath.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro
735 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 15:27:43
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Wow I am shocked with this trade. I thought for sure they were trading Price away. After two unsuccessful seasons and plus he was being booed off the ice night in and night out. They still go with him. Also Halak yes he had a good hot run this season and you can't judge on that. But the truth is that his numbers has been great at every level he played, International, ECHL, QMJHL, AHL and even NHL. He's still young and he just keeps improving. I could see Halak turn into somebody like Kipper.
Sure Price has the potential, but I think the pressure in Montreal is too big for him.
Also the only reason I would have traded Halak over Price is if Halak would have had a higher trading value and the team could have gotten something big. Not just two prospects who might or might not turn into steady NHL players.
Another thing is I'm sure, with time, as the draft approaches or as the regular season approaches, they could have gotten more.
Go St Louis!!!!! |
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Jumbo Joe Rocks
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
410 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 15:37:17
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I am shocked they traded Halak who will be their goalie now I wonder???
I am shocked but I would be just pissed if they traded Lapierre,Yaou know not unless it was to the Sharks or Leafs.
RE-SIGN PATTY |
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leafsfan_101
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1530 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 16:01:32
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I am also shocked! I thought Price was on the way out for sure, especially since his confidence was really ratted in Montreal. Halak has a much more calm demenor, and he seems to thrive in the Montreal pressure, something Halak does not.
Now as to the return, I personally think that it could have been much higher. Eller looks to be promising, and his is pegged to be a scoring forward. His scouting report is as shows:
quote:
ASSETS: Has excellent playmaking skills, some finish and the versatility to play either center or wing. Doesn't mind playing in high-traffic areas and is also a sound defensive forward.
FLAWS: Needs to improve his shot in order to score more goals. Must also gain more strength to better handle bigger defenders at the highest level.
CAREER POTENTIAL: Versatile scoring forward.
Schultz is a more long term prospect with some upside. I see him as more of a power forward, Dustin Byfuglien type. But still, this was the Blues 3rd best prospect, and it is not even a guarentee that they both pan out, if Schultz even amounts to anything.
It looks like it was straight up Eller for Halak, and if so, Eller has the pressure of the hockey world on his shoulders to perform. If he is a bust, and with this pressure it looks like it is possible, then St. Louis just stole a trade. Halak has a huge ceiling, and now without the pressure of Montreal he may be able to flourish even better.
Last year was not a fluke, Halak is the real deal. STL wins this one, and Habs fans should pray to God that Eller pans out. |
Edited by - leafsfan_101 on 06/17/2010 16:02:20 |
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just1n
PickupHockey Pro
282 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 16:40:20
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| There likely wasn't a lot of interest in Price from other teams. Keep in mind that the free agent goalie pool is quite deep, so the Habs GM is getting something while he can... I was shocked to see this news though for sure! |
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FLYING -V
Top Prospect
69 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 16:50:35
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I dont't know why this trade surprised me as much as it did, seeing as habs management has touted Carey Price as the next big thing in goal since they drafted him.
However recently I'd been leaning towards him being the goalie on the way out, considering his relatively high trade value,his poor relationship with Montreal's fans and Halak's phenomenal play down the stretch as well as in the playoffs. But, I seem to have been mistaken.
I like this deal better for St. Louis, as the risk is quite a bit less, and the potential reward is far greater. First off, the blues don't need lars eller, considering they already have a plethora of young players at their disposal, and I've honestly never heard of Ian Schultz..
Now, let me say i think price is going to turn out all right, but he has yet to really prove himself as an NHL starter, and who knows where things will go , Montreal could be the one shopping for a goaltender soon, and if Halak does prove to be the real deal,the habs will be kicking themselves.
On the other hand the upside for St. Louis is huge, if Halak plays half as good as he did down the stretch(which,given the impressive composure this kid has is more than likely), the blues become a major player in the west. While even if Eller turns out, his max upside is probably as a top six forward, boy, the habs sure need another one of those.
I definitely think this trade is tilted in favour of the blues, which is good, because I HATE Montreal
Its not worth winning if you cant win big! |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 17:58:34
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Flying-V, you raise an interesting point - IMO Montreal management has had a very biased view towards Price, and have never (to my knowledge) really embraced Halak as a member of the team. Halak took over the starting position in MTL, but basically had to play stellar hockey to just keep getting the next start - at the slightest faltering Price was back in net (and usually quite mediocre).
I was surprised that Halak was traded, but only because he had such a stellar playoff run that I thought "now, the Habs must know they have the real deal here". I guess not.
Another thought - they might have been thinking bux. It's possible that they had felt Halak out but realized that his asking price would be higher than then could afford (or wanted to afford). Price struggled this year, so one must think that his next contract will not be a particularly large one - they should be able to get him under contract for 2 years @ 1-1.5 M per year. I have no doubt that Halak will see 4M/year in his first deal with STL.
Still, as I said before, this trade will take a few years to guage.
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 18:07:36
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if i told you philly traded Leighton for Eller and Schultz you'd all be saying what the hell is philly thinking,, right?? other than the fact one player is 28 and the other 25 they ve both accomplished about the same things this year,,, obviously i know Halak is better than leighton but i really dont see Halak having much more potential thank Eller ,, Eller has always played against men (swedish elite league) he didn't play junior major 1 year ago he lead his team in scoring in the AHL last year in points and in 7 nhl games has 2 goals when he is not suppose to be a goal scorer, hes big and hes a center and defensivly resposible making him the entire package a very rare package in the NHL. Big time strength down the middle is what the habs need! booed of the ice night in night out come on leaf fans,,, he was booed a few times,,,,, i go to 15 to 20 games a year and i have never herd price booed off the ice, and acutally you know how many games this year price made 40 plus saves and lost 2-1 or 1 nothing down the stretch price played very well on the west coast he just couldn't beat the sharks and far superior teams,, dont get me wrong Halak is the bettter goalie,,, but if Eller steps up and scores say 40 points as a rookie and then continues to improve from these totals (which is completely possible given his pedigree and current play,,,) how smart do the habs look,, what killed the habs this year? because besides Cammalleri and Gionta noone scores for the canadians! we had two good goalies all year and a pretty solid bottom 6 and a pretty solid D what we need desperatly is top 6, like Eller is suppose to be!
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Guest2268
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Posted - 06/17/2010 : 18:26:11
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| I think the point people are trying to make here Pasty and your not seeing is the simple fact that Halak was unbelieveable in the post season. Great goalies which he was and should be are VERY , VERY hard to come by. One month they are comparing him to P.Roy, the next he is gone. If his greatness continues, NO PROSPECT equals his value !!! This guy practically beat Washington himself...with Scary - Cary in goal for a full season Montreal may miss the playoffs. Montreal would not have made the post season this year with price in goal down the stretch....NO WAY. |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 18:51:23
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I'm not liking this trade, personally.
To me, Halak is worth a little more than Montreal received.
Even if others put in qualifying offers, Montreal would have received some picks for Halak, which, i'm sure others would have.
Also, the closer to draft day/free agency, the better the deals would likely have got. If you can't pull the trigger, you re-sign him! No skin off the Canadiens back, either way.
I'll comment more in a bit.
Irvine/prez. |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 18:52:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest2268
I think the point people are trying to make here Pasty and your not seeing is the simple fact that Halak was unbelieveable in the post season. Great goalies which he was and should be are VERY , VERY hard to come by. One month they are comparing him to P.Roy, the next he is gone. If his greatness continues, NO PROSPECT equals his value !!! This guy practically beat Washington himself...with Scary - Cary in goal for a full season Montreal may miss the playoffs. Montreal would not have made the post season this year with price in goal down the stretch....NO WAY.
agreed but Halak did not beat the caps or the pens by himself.... a certain player scored 12 goals in 14 games over those two series.... yes Halak was brilliant for what 20 games this year? no more and dont tell me he was because then you didn t watch him play,,,, he won a lot of games at the begining of the year and played very badly, im not saying he is a bad goalie i like Halak and i honestly believe the habs wanted to keep him but if lars eller is what he is suppose to be we are a better team today no question,, we had two good goalies,,, please dont tell me Halak was a superstar he has never playe a full season and had one hot playoff run even leighton and Neimi did that, i am not knocking halak i love him as much as any hockey fan and we have to build a better team here in montreal regardless of how close we were this year we are not winning a cup with this team,, the biggest knock being we have no big two way center,,, thats what we just went out and got,,,
Pasty |
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leafsfan_101
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1530 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 19:06:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
quote:
Originally posted by Guest2268
I think the point people are trying to make here Pasty and your not seeing is the simple fact that Halak was unbelieveable in the post season. Great goalies which he was and should be are VERY , VERY hard to come by. One month they are comparing him to P.Roy, the next he is gone. If his greatness continues, NO PROSPECT equals his value !!! This guy practically beat Washington himself...with Scary - Cary in goal for a full season Montreal may miss the playoffs. Montreal would not have made the post season this year with price in goal down the stretch....NO WAY.
agreed but Halak did not beat the caps or the pens by himself.... a certain player scored 12 goals in 14 games over those two series.... yes Halak was brilliant for what 20 games this year? no more and dont tell me he was because then you didn t watch him play,,,, he won a lot of games at the begining of the year and played very badly, im not saying he is a bad goalie i like Halak and i honestly believe the habs wanted to keep him but if lars eller is what he is suppose to be we are a better team today no question,, we had two good goalies,,, please dont tell me Halak was a superstar he has never playe a full season and had one hot playoff run even leighton and Neimi did that, i am not knocking halak i love him as much as any hockey fan and we have to build a better team here in montreal regardless of how close we were this year we are not winning a cup with this team,, the biggest knock being we have no big two way center,,, thats what we just went out and got,,,
Pasty
It doesn't matter how good Cammalerri was in those two series, without Halak's brillience the Habs are done in 4. Halak saved the Habs this postseason, there is no denying that. For as good as Cammy was, Halak was the sole reason they got out of the first two series. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 20:52:27
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Just so you know Pasty, you may not realise this because you're not a Leafs fan, but our view is also a little coloured by the Halak played specifically against the Leafs - he played lights out against us almost every time. Halak was a Leaf killer, and I am glad to see him go.
But yeah, I know Halak had a couple of stretches of letting in some weak goals (just not against my Leafs, ergh!), but overall, he showed all the composure and skill of a starting veteran goalie. This is what I see,
I'll put it this way: as a Montreal goalie, it says a lot to me when you actually do play "lights out" against your old hated rival, even if we are having a bad season. The Leafs media attention, the head NHL offices being in TO, everything - it's like NY in the states. It's a lot of added pressure for no other reason than exposure to a lot more people. You can't deby the pressure of big markets. And who excelled? Halak. Who stunk up the joint? Price. Seriously, I think we only played Price twice, maybe three times (off the top of my drunken head) because of that - always got Halak against the Leafs, 'cause he played great against us.
It says something. That, and plus the overall better stats, performance under pressure, and overall skill level. Why would a team choose the worse goalie?
It's stupidity, caused by stubborness. Gainey is too damn stubborn to release his mistake, thus, he heaps more pressure on him.
The ONLY way Montreal makes me go, "Oh! I see now . . ." is if they have already talked with Nabakov and are going to sign him . . . but hell, that'd be a mistake too I reckon
Bottom line: Any of you this think this is a good deal for Montreal, answer me this -
Why would it be to your advantage to get rid of the best goalie?
I don't think anyone entertains the idea that Price is better than Halak up to this point, hmmm? If so . . . let's hear your argument!
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 20:55:27
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ps. I am drunk. But after reading through my spelling and grammatical errors, I will leave it . . . as a testament.
What a crazy, crazy bad deal for the Habs. Buds rejoice!
Me happy.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 22:40:05
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quote:
if i told you philly traded Leighton for Eller and Schultz you'd all be saying what the hell is philly thinking,, right?? other than the fact one player is 28 and the other 25 they ve both accomplished about the same things this year,,, obviously i know Halak is better than leighton
I think you said it all right there. On paper they look about the same, but I think any team in hockey would take Halak over Leighton as their starting goalie next season.
Something tells me that if those players were offered for Leighton, the Flyers would have jumped at it.
quote:
Eller has always played against men (swedish elite league) he didn't play junior major 1 year ago he lead his team in scoring in the AHL last year in points and in 7 nhl games has 2 goals when he is not suppose to be a goal scorer, hes big and hes a center and defensivly resposible making him the entire package a very rare package in the NHL. Big time strength down the middle is what the habs need! booed of the ice night in night out come on leaf fans,,, he was booed a few times,,,,, i go to 15 to 20 games a year and i have never herd price booed off the ice, and acutally you know how many games this year price made 40 plus saves and lost 2-1 or 1 nothing down the stretch price played very well on the west coast he just couldn't beat the sharks and far superior teams,, dont get me wrong Halak is the bettter goalie,,, but if Eller steps up and scores say 40 points as a rookie and then continues to improve from these totals (which is completely possible given his pedigree and current play,,,) how smart do the habs look,, what killed the habs this year? because besides Cammalleri and Gionta noone scores for the canadians! we had two good goalies all year and a pretty solid bottom 6 and a pretty solid D what we need desperatly is top 6, like Eller is suppose to be!
Unfortunatly Patsy, all the offensive upside for the team and the prospects will not matter if Price plays like he did this past year. He can be good, but he still has more bad than good. More bad than good is not going to get the Canadians back to the post season.
On this day, Montreal traded away the better goalie, in the hopes that they kept the goalie that will be better in the future. Time will tell.
As a Canucks fan, I am dismayed that we'll see more of Halak next year - although we only play STL 4 times a year. When the Habs came to town last year in October the Canucks lit up Price for 7 goals on 32 shots. When we visited Montreal in Feb Halak had one of his miracle outings, only 2 goals allowed on 47 shots. Sigh... |
Edited by - nuxfan on 06/17/2010 22:40:55 |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2010 : 22:57:36
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To me, the biggest issue with Price is his maturity level. He's just not mature enough, for A) The NHL & B) More specifically, a City like Montreal.
If Price can get his head on straight, and start playing each game like it could be his last, he can be a performer. But, as I said previously, he just shows no heart. It almost seems like, he takes playing in the NHL for granted.
Perhaps Halak stealing the show from him, has shown him that he can't take it for granted. That just maybe, he could be out next. And, he'll have to work for it.
Although, it may show him the opposite. It could show him that, he can under perform, play with no heart or determination, and yet again, Montreal will trade away the 'other' goalie, in favor of Price.
A la Cristobal Huet, now Jaroslav Halak. Price remains... somehow.
Irvine/prez. |
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Guest6349
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Posted - 06/17/2010 : 23:00:09
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| If Bob Ganey was still GM Halak would still be a canadien and price would be traded. But this trade makes me wonder if the Habs are gonna get a vet goalie to back up price.Maybe this trade is telling us that the habs may go for Naby or Turco, now these goalies may be past there prime, But there both good season goalies, But this is gonna be a good off season for the Habs to see who they bring in to back up price. Watching the Habs go all the way to the east final with Halak was asome and this maybe the stupidest thing they have ever done trading him away for nothing, reminds me two years ago when they traded Huet away to the caps for nothing. |
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Guest4227
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Posted - 06/18/2010 : 02:51:41
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It's not like they traded a RFA for 2 first round picks and a 2nd.
There's only so many gms's that would do a deal like that. |
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Guest8241
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Posted - 06/18/2010 : 06:28:03
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Hmm....crap deal, would truly like to see Price turn into a complete bum and Habs fans wish we had Halak back. Way to not appreciate his efforts...
Fun fact, in Halak's tenure as a Hab (06-10) he had a .700 Win Percentage...
Prices in the same span, .549...
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Rambo2305
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
546 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 06:39:20
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I've never liked Price, now I want him to fail even more. As a Leaf fan though, Halak was one of the few Canadiens I have ever had a soft spot for. He was never given the credit he deserved, and obviously Gautier didn't care much for him looking at the garbage he took in exchange for Halak...plain and simple...since 08, Halak has been better...
I know the Leafs aren't winning the cup next year, so...LETS GO BLUES!!! Just to piss off the Habs fans, I wonder how long until they "Split" Price's time with whoever the back-up is? |
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Rambo2305
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
546 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 06:45:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest6349
If Bob Ganey was still GM Halak would still be a canadien and price would be traded. But this trade makes me wonder if the Habs are gonna get a vet goalie to back up price.Maybe this trade is telling us that the habs may go for Naby or Turco, now these goalies may be past there prime, But there both good season goalies, But this is gonna be a good off season for the Habs to see who they bring in to back up price. Watching the Habs go all the way to the east final with Halak was asome and this maybe the stupidest thing they have ever done trading him away for nothing, reminds me two years ago when they traded Huet away to the caps for nothing.
WAIT! you actually suggest using Nabokov, EVGENI NABOKOV...40+ wins a year Nabokov as a back-up to Price??? I think one Habs fan got ahold of some Newfie-screech and drank wayyyy too much.
Apparently , some Habs fans have their minds corrupted with Pierre McGuires thought on Price being the next Roy... |
Edited by - Rambo2305 on 06/18/2010 06:46:31 |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 07:48:58
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Halaks stats for this season
2009-10 Montreal NHL 45 26 13 5 2630 105 1386 2.40 .924 5
Price's stats in 07 08
2007-08 Montreal NHL 41 24 12 3 2413 103 1282 2.56 .920 3
now tell if price is such a bum right? and Halak is a sure thing right? this is what you have all been saying , now why when they put up vfery very similar numbers in their breakout season is Halak Guranteed to be a superstar and Price is a loser? Why is Halak Exempt from the route Price went down and well pretty much every goalie in the history of the NHL a slight decline after the breakout season? forget what the media says stop watching highlioghts and start watching hockey,, was Halak the better goalie since 09 10 season hell yess , will he be better who knows, the habs are taking a guess, if they are tradeing halak its because noone offerd anything decent for price and they dont want to pay to goalies when they can get the center they need with one of them.. is it a mistake could be,, but like i said if price plays half as good as he is suppose to and Eller scores 40 points we are a winner in this,, and this scenrio is entirly possible
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 08:20:28
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It was painfully obvious that Montreal could not resign both goalies. One had to go. I think we can all make the logical assumption that both goalies were on the table and the offers for Price were simply not as good as those for Halak. Secondly, the actual value of the player is rarely if ever the market value the team will receive for the player. RFA - Meaning the players is not signed and must be. It is better than a UFA as arbitration could be put into play, however RFA none the less.Ultimately, this is a deal much like the Bouwmeester to Calgary 'trade'. The deal was ultimately to have exclusive rights to negotiate contract prior to July 1. That deal was Jordan Leopold and a 3rd round pick. That was for (at the time) the most sought after UFA defensemen of the season!!
Finally, what makes Halak so friggin valuable?? A solid Olympics and 2 stellar playoff series?? Guys, are you serious?? As previously stated, Leighton had pretty similar numbers as Halak (better GAA, slightly worse save %) granted facing few shots. However, no one is out there saying that Leighton is a legitimate #1 keeper??I keep going back to the story, but it is so relevant and valid it's hard not to. Remember a few years ago when Cristobal Huet was 'tossed aside' by those foolish Montreal Canadiens and the deal was so horrible??? Well, at that time, Huet's Montreal stats line was:
117 GP, 58W, 39L, 13OTL, 2.53 GAA, .920 save percentage.
He is now riding the pines in Chicago, in a back up role, and Stan Bowman is hat in hand with the owners to get his contract bought out.
Now, the creepily similar comparison is Halak's Stat Line.
101 GP, 56W, 34L, 7OTL, 2.62 GAA, .919 save percentage
Goalies really have proven nothing in the NHL until around the 200 game mark at the earliest. Halak is barely 1/2 way there and as easily as he can be the next Lundqvist, he can also be the next Huet.
No one is questioning his potential but it's still a risk. A risk, RFA is not worth everything and the kitchen sink.
1st and a 3rd round pick would be an great deal for Halak. That's exactly what this deal is, only the players have been picked already. I am not saying this is the right deal for Montreal. I would have traded Price as well, even if the deal was not as good. However, looking at the deal that was made, considering the entire situation, saying it's fair is reasonable.
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Guest2360
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Posted - 06/18/2010 : 10:13:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
Halaks stats for this season
2009-10 Montreal NHL 45 26 13 5 2630 105 1386 2.40 .924 5
Price's stats in 07 08
2007-08 Montreal NHL 41 24 12 3 2413 103 1282 2.56 .920 3
now tell if price is such a bum right? and Halak is a sure thing right? this is what you have all been saying , now why when they put up vfery very similar numbers in their breakout season is Halak Guranteed to be a superstar and Price is a loser? Why is Halak Exempt from the route Price went down and well pretty much every goalie in the history of the NHL a slight decline after the breakout season? forget what the media says stop watching highlioghts and start watching hockey,, was Halak the better goalie since 09 10 season hell yess , will he be better who knows, the habs are taking a guess, if they are tradeing halak its because noone offerd anything decent for price and they dont want to pay to goalies when they can get the center they need with one of them.. is it a mistake could be,, but like i said if price plays half as good as he is suppose to and Eller scores 40 points we are a winner in this,, and this scenrio is entirly possible
Pasty
Actually I was on the Habs forum and they were indicating that St.Louis actually approached PG about Price, but he said "no" and offered Halak in return. |
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ReyR
Top Prospect
13 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 10:33:56
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I think most people who are complaining about the trade are underestimating the cap side of this.
I don't claim to be a cap expert, but a quick glance at capgeek shows they have 14 players committed for next season at about $45M (incl. Eller at about 875+bonuses). This leaves about $11M for 9 players (assuming 23 man roster) including two goalies, UFAs like Plekanec, Mara, Moore, MA Bergeron, and RFAs like Pyatt, S. Kostitsyn, Pouliot, and Lapierre.
Like Beans said, you have to compare your returns on both and the cost to the team next year and whether you really want to gamble on Halak.
Choice:
1) Price at probably $2-3M + the 2 guys from Halak trade, or
2) Halak at $4-5M + ??? What could you get for Price right now?
Option 2 has some risks: nobody bites on the Price trade and now you have potentially $7-8M in 2 goalies and now only $3M in cap space or you trade Price for maybe one prospect or a future pick.
It's hard to say it's a "good" trade for Mtl, but it's fair taking the situation into consideration. |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 11:31:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest2360
quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
Halaks stats for this season
2009-10 Montreal NHL 45 26 13 5 2630 105 1386 2.40 .924 5
Price's stats in 07 08
2007-08 Montreal NHL 41 24 12 3 2413 103 1282 2.56 .920 3
now tell if price is such a bum right? and Halak is a sure thing right? this is what you have all been saying , now why when they put up vfery very similar numbers in their breakout season is Halak Guranteed to be a superstar and Price is a loser? Why is Halak Exempt from the route Price went down and well pretty much every goalie in the history of the NHL a slight decline after the breakout season? forget what the media says stop watching highlioghts and start watching hockey,, was Halak the better goalie since 09 10 season hell yess , will he be better who knows, the habs are taking a guess, if they are tradeing halak its because noone offerd anything decent for price and they dont want to pay to goalies when they can get the center they need with one of them.. is it a mistake could be,, but like i said if price plays half as good as he is suppose to and Eller scores 40 points we are a winner in this,, and this scenrio is entirly possible
Pasty
Actually I was on the Habs forum and they were indicating that St.Louis actually approached PG about Price, but he said "no" and offered Halak in return.
yeah put up a credible source and i will take you half way seriously, i could say whatever i want on this forum doesn't mean it happend
Pasty |
Edited by - Pasty7 on 06/18/2010 11:33:14 |
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Guest2360
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Posted - 06/18/2010 : 12:07:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
quote:
Originally posted by Guest2360
quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
Halaks stats for this season
2009-10 Montreal NHL 45 26 13 5 2630 105 1386 2.40 .924 5
Price's stats in 07 08
2007-08 Montreal NHL 41 24 12 3 2413 103 1282 2.56 .920 3
now tell if price is such a bum right? and Halak is a sure thing right? this is what you have all been saying , now why when they put up vfery very similar numbers in their breakout season is Halak Guranteed to be a superstar and Price is a loser? Why is Halak Exempt from the route Price went down and well pretty much every goalie in the history of the NHL a slight decline after the breakout season? forget what the media says stop watching highlioghts and start watching hockey,, was Halak the better goalie since 09 10 season hell yess , will he be better who knows, the habs are taking a guess, if they are tradeing halak its because noone offerd anything decent for price and they dont want to pay to goalies when they can get the center they need with one of them.. is it a mistake could be,, but like i said if price plays half as good as he is suppose to and Eller scores 40 points we are a winner in this,, and this scenrio is entirly possible
Pasty
Actually I was on the Habs forum and they were indicating that St.Louis actually approached PG about Price, but he said "no" and offered Halak in return.
yeah put up a credible source and i will take you half way seriously, i could say whatever i want on this forum doesn't mean it happend
Pasty
Ok fine. Let's disregard the source for a second and turn it into a hypothetical. What would your opinion if that were the case where they refused to give up Price? |
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ReyR
Top Prospect
13 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 12:24:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest2360
quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
quote:
Originally posted by Guest2360
quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
Halaks stats for this season
2009-10 Montreal NHL 45 26 13 5 2630 105 1386 2.40 .924 5
Price's stats in 07 08
2007-08 Montreal NHL 41 24 12 3 2413 103 1282 2.56 .920 3
now tell if price is such a bum right? and Halak is a sure thing right? this is what you have all been saying , now why when they put up vfery very similar numbers in their breakout season is Halak Guranteed to be a superstar and Price is a loser? Why is Halak Exempt from the route Price went down and well pretty much every goalie in the history of the NHL a slight decline after the breakout season? forget what the media says stop watching highlioghts and start watching hockey,, was Halak the better goalie since 09 10 season hell yess , will he be better who knows, the habs are taking a guess, if they are tradeing halak its because noone offerd anything decent for price and they dont want to pay to goalies when they can get the center they need with one of them.. is it a mistake could be,, but like i said if price plays half as good as he is suppose to and Eller scores 40 points we are a winner in this,, and this scenrio is entirly possible
Pasty
Actually I was on the Habs forum and they were indicating that St.Louis actually approached PG about Price, but he said "no" and offered Halak in return.
yeah put up a credible source and i will take you half way seriously, i could say whatever i want on this forum doesn't mean it happend
Pasty
Ok fine. Let's disregard the source for a second and turn it into a hypothetical. What would your opinion if that were the case where they refused to give up Price?
Are we assuming that Mtl is getting the same return? I'm not sure that's a fair assumption to make. If this was true, we would first have to know what St Louis was offering for Price.
If true, St Louis most likely offered less for Price and Montreal thought that it wasn't even worth it and asked what they would offer for Halak instead. |
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Guest4227
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Posted - 06/18/2010 : 12:47:48
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It's not like they traded a RFA for 2 first round picks and a 2nd.
There's only so many gms's that would do a deal like that. |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 13:13:52
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quote:
Originally posted by ReyR
quote:
Originally posted by Guest2360
quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
quote:
Originally posted by Guest2360
quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
Halaks stats for this season
2009-10 Montreal NHL 45 26 13 5 2630 105 1386 2.40 .924 5
Price's stats in 07 08
2007-08 Montreal NHL 41 24 12 3 2413 103 1282 2.56 .920 3
now tell if price is such a bum right? and Halak is a sure thing right? this is what you have all been saying , now why when they put up vfery very similar numbers in their breakout season is Halak Guranteed to be a superstar and Price is a loser? Why is Halak Exempt from the route Price went down and well pretty much every goalie in the history of the NHL a slight decline after the breakout season? forget what the media says stop watching highlioghts and start watching hockey,, was Halak the better goalie since 09 10 season hell yess , will he be better who knows, the habs are taking a guess, if they are tradeing halak its because noone offerd anything decent for price and they dont want to pay to goalies when they can get the center they need with one of them.. is it a mistake could be,, but like i said if price plays half as good as he is suppose to and Eller scores 40 points we are a winner in this,, and this scenrio is entirly possible
Pasty
Actually I was on the Habs forum and they were indicating that St.Louis actually approached PG about Price, but he said "no" and offered Halak in return.
yeah put up a credible source and i will take you half way seriously, i could say whatever i want on this forum doesn't mean it happend
Pasty
Ok fine. Let's disregard the source for a second and turn it into a hypothetical. What would your opinion if that were the case where they refused to give up Price?
Are we assuming that Mtl is getting the same return? I'm not sure that's a fair assumption to make. If this was true, we would first have to know what St Louis was offering for Price.
If true, St Louis most likely offered less for Price and Montreal thought that it wasn't even worth it and asked what they would offer for Halak instead.
exactly for the same return i keep Halak and trade price
Pasty |
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leafsfan_101
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1530 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 14:43:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
Halaks stats for this season
2009-10 Montreal NHL 45 26 13 5 2630 105 1386 2.40 .924 5
Price's stats in 07 08
2007-08 Montreal NHL 41 24 12 3 2413 103 1282 2.56 .920 3
now tell if price is such a bum right? and Halak is a sure thing right? this is what you have all been saying , now why when they put up vfery very similar numbers in their breakout season is Halak Guranteed to be a superstar and Price is a loser? Why is Halak Exempt from the route Price went down and well pretty much every goalie in the history of the NHL a slight decline after the breakout season? forget what the media says stop watching highlioghts and start watching hockey,, was Halak the better goalie since 09 10 season hell yess , will he be better who knows, the habs are taking a guess, if they are tradeing halak its because noone offerd anything decent for price and they dont want to pay to goalies when they can get the center they need with one of them.. is it a mistake could be,, but like i said if price plays half as good as he is suppose to and Eller scores 40 points we are a winner in this,, and this scenrio is entirly possible
Pasty
Why do you think nobody payed anything for Price? Because he has lost his confidence. Is it just me or does everyone see it too. Carey Price is not comfortable in the net with Montreal. Pasty, you wanna know why Halak won't be the same as Price? Because when he had his breakout season, he was 25, not 18.
Halak is more mature than Price is, and he is the better goalie. It is more of a "What have you done for me lately" scenario. Why bring up Price's 2007 - 2008 season when his 2009 - 2010 seaosn was terrible. Montreal is taking a huge gamble here, but nobody here can just say that Price will bounce back and Halak will suddenly falter. This trade won't make Halak worse or Price better overnight, it all depends on how they react to the situation. And right now, I think Montreal made the wrong call.
Ohh, and Pasty, you want me to tell you that Price is a bum?
2009–10 Montreal Canadiens NHL 41 13 20 5 2358 109 0 2.77 .912
There ya go bud. |
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leafsfan_101
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1530 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 15:00:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
It was painfully obvious that Montreal could not resign both goalies. One had to go. I think we can all make the logical assumption that both goalies were on the table and the offers for Price were simply not as good as those for Halak. Secondly, the actual value of the player is rarely if ever the market value the team will receive for the player. RFA - Meaning the players is not signed and must be. It is better than a UFA as arbitration could be put into play, however RFA none the less.Ultimately, this is a deal much like the Bouwmeester to Calgary 'trade'. The deal was ultimately to have exclusive rights to negotiate contract prior to July 1. That deal was Jordan Leopold and a 3rd round pick. That was for (at the time) the most sought after UFA defensemen of the season!!
Finally, what makes Halak so friggin valuable?? A solid Olympics and 2 stellar playoff series?? Guys, are you serious?? As previously stated, Leighton had pretty similar numbers as Halak (better GAA, slightly worse save %) granted facing few shots. However, no one is out there saying that Leighton is a legitimate #1 keeper??I keep going back to the story, but it is so relevant and valid it's hard not to. Remember a few years ago when Cristobal Huet was 'tossed aside' by those foolish Montreal Canadiens and the deal was so horrible??? Well, at that time, Huet's Montreal stats line was:
117 GP, 58W, 39L, 13OTL, 2.53 GAA, .920 save percentage.
He is now riding the pines in Chicago, in a back up role, and Stan Bowman is hat in hand with the owners to get his contract bought out.
Now, the creepily similar comparison is Halak's Stat Line.
101 GP, 56W, 34L, 7OTL, 2.62 GAA, .919 save percentage
Goalies really have proven nothing in the NHL until around the 200 game mark at the earliest. Halak is barely 1/2 way there and as easily as he can be the next Lundqvist, he can also be the next Huet.
No one is questioning his potential but it's still a risk. A risk, RFA is not worth everything and the kitchen sink.
1st and a 3rd round pick would be an great deal for Halak. That's exactly what this deal is, only the players have been picked already. I am not saying this is the right deal for Montreal. I would have traded Price as well, even if the deal was not as good. However, looking at the deal that was made, considering the entire situation, saying it's fair is reasonable.
Beans, a lot of what you said does make sense. But I think you are seriously missing something here. Huet, nor Price, has ever really carried a team through adversity like Halak just did. Both have completely faltered in the NHL playoffs. Now I don't want to make this about stats, because Halak cannot be judged on stats alone.
Halak carried his team to the Conference Finals singlehandedly. Say what you want about Mike Cammalleri, Hall Gill's shot blocking, or Youppi! for all care. Without Halak, Washington sweeps Montreal.
Now I don't know if you watch hockey Beans, because if you did then you could not possibly make an argument towards the similarities of Michael Leighton and Jaroslav Halak. Stat wise you could, but that would be foolish, since if you had seen Halak down the stretch and in the Playoffs (along with the Olympics), then you could not possibly compare the two.
I know that there are cap stipulations, but you also have to things which are in the best interests of the team. In this case, Halak shouldn't have beem traded. And for all of the chance that he could be the next Cristobel Huet, Halak is much different.
Remember to, Huet was shipped out in favour of Price. Imagine how he would of played had he stayed. |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 15:24:29
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quote:
Originally posted by leafsfan_101
quote:
Originally posted by Pasty7
Halaks stats for this season
2009-10 Montreal NHL 45 26 13 5 2630 105 1386 2.40 .924 5
Price's stats in 07 08
2007-08 Montreal NHL 41 24 12 3 2413 103 1282 2.56 .920 3
now tell if price is such a bum right? and Halak is a sure thing right? this is what you have all been saying , now why when they put up vfery very similar numbers in their breakout season is Halak Guranteed to be a superstar and Price is a loser? Why is Halak Exempt from the route Price went down and well pretty much every goalie in the history of the NHL a slight decline after the breakout season? forget what the media says stop watching highlioghts and start watching hockey,, was Halak the better goalie since 09 10 season hell yess , will he be better who knows, the habs are taking a guess, if they are tradeing halak its because noone offerd anything decent for price and they dont want to pay to goalies when they can get the center they need with one of them.. is it a mistake could be,, but like i said if price plays half as good as he is suppose to and Eller scores 40 points we are a winner in this,, and this scenrio is entirly possible
Pasty
Why do you think nobody payed anything for Price? Because he has lost his confidence. Is it just me or does everyone see it too. Carey Price is not comfortable in the net with Montreal. Pasty, you wanna know why Halak won't be the same as Price? Because when he had his breakout season, he was 25, not 18.
Halak is more mature than Price is, and he is the better goalie. It is more of a "What have you done for me lately" scenario. Why bring up Price's 2007 - 2008 season when his 2009 - 2010 seaosn was terrible. Montreal is taking a huge gamble here, but nobody here can just say that Price will bounce back and Halak will suddenly falter. This trade won't make Halak worse or Price better overnight, it all depends on how they react to the situation. And right now, I think Montreal made the wrong call.
Ohh, and Pasty, you want me to tell you that Price is a bum?
2009–10 Montreal Canadiens NHL 41 13 20 5 2358 109 0 2.77 .912
There ya go bud.
yeah 912 sv % for a 21 year old goalie makes him a bum,,, you`re real smart keep watching highlights and not games,, really when was the last time any of you watched a whole hockey game because imo you havnt ina while or you at least dont understand what you re watching
Pasty |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 15:28:13
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for gods sake if Halak was alone on the ice the habs don`t win a single playoff came this frustrates me to no end,, halak was also pulled 3 times in the playoffs noone did anything single handidly ,,, take away 12 goals in 14 games and im sorry the caps sweep the habs too , add 6 shots on goal espcially in a power play situation and maybe Halak looks a little more Human really give your head a shake single handed yeah and i`m gonna make the NHL next year watch a game every once and while then talk hockey
Pasty |
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Deaner
Rookie
Canada
107 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2010 : 15:29:46
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| im pretty shocked at this one. I thought halak was going to be the habs number one goalie next season and price would be gone. As a leafs fan i am happy because i think price has a lot to prove still and im not sure he will step up to the challenges ahead of him...who knows |
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Topic |
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Halak traded to St Louis 
