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admin
Forum Admin
Canada
2341 Posts |
 Posted - 01/27/2011 : 17:56:09
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Poll Question:
Garth Snow has suspended Evgeni Nabokov for not reporting to the club after being claimed off of waivers. Should the Islanders have suspended him?
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deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2011 : 18:53:09
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I honestly do not think that a suspension is "sending a message" in any way . . . standard practice, and any team would have done it I think.
Nabakov will regret that move dearly, I predict.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2011 : 18:54:06
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| While i know most people will probably say that sure, they have ever right to suspend him, i don't know, i still don't like it. Then again i don't like the rule in general. The Islanders didn't do anything wrong in putting in a claim for Nabokov, and he is refusing to report to the team so they do have every right to suspend him, but personally i would rather just see them put him back on waivers & put the whole thing behind them. |
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HawkinOilCountry
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
318 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2011 : 18:59:22
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The Islanders were right to suspend him, because that's what happens when you don't report.
BUT... The Islanders were stupid stupid STOOPID wrong to claim him in the first place. Seriously... Nabby didn't sign with Detroit because he wants to play in the regular season, he wanted a contender. The Islanders should've seen this coming a mile a way. Hell I called when I heard that he had to clear waivers.
This is the dumbest thing I've seen a hockey club do in a long time.
The arena wall in chicago should be credited with a goal. |
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4809 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2011 : 19:00:42
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But Ryan, the NHL in this case I will defend:
They have to protect their best interests, and by putting rules like this in place, they make it very difficult for decent players and above to go somewhere else when offered big money, then come back to some winning team when it suits them as if nothing happened. It gives players a big incentive to stay loyal to the NHL, basically.
And that's something I can't diagree with, especially with the potential money floating around in Russia, Sweden and other parts of Europe.
Frankly, Nabakov should be happy that an NHL team is willing to take him . . . has no one questioned WHY he is coming back?
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2011 : 19:19:42
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| Well said slozo, i see where you're coming from. I suppose you're right. |
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Guest5806
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Posted - 01/27/2011 : 19:36:40
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| no, it's just a petty move by a bitter GM |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2011 : 20:36:50
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I see nothing wrong with it.:
a) they didn't do it out of malice, they actually do have a legitimate need for a goalie (see their current roster for details, but they're currently playing a 3rd and 4th string goalie tandem)
b) Nabby should have known better. Honestly, did he really think he was going to end up with DET out of this? If he did, his agent should be fired, or Nabby should give his head a shake. NYI was surely not the only team to put in a waiver request, there were a lot of teams to go through before DET was going to get their shot.
In this case, it doesn't matter where Nabby wanted to go - he's on freaking waivers! Hockey players are so short sighted - if he didn't want to be in this situation, he should have signed one of the contracts offered to him last offseason, in order to control his destiny. But, because he was a greedy whiny baby that couldn't possibly take a pay cut in the NHL, he's now stuck in this situation that could keep him within the Islanders organization thru the rest of this year and all next year.
IMO, he should cut his losses now - play for the Islanders, finish out the season, prove he still can play at a top level, and sign a real deal for next season. The nice thing about contenders - there is one every year. |
Edited by - nuxfan on 01/27/2011 20:37:10 |
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Guest5958
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Posted - 01/27/2011 : 23:35:46
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a) Who knows what kind of offers Nabby garnered in the off season?
b) How can you hold it against the guy for going to play in his home country?
a) + b) = no need to call him a "greedy whiny baby"
c) Have you heard/read what Nab has had to say about the situation? First off, they knew the rules and they would have to go through the waivers. And second, that it makes no sense for him to play for the Isles at this point in his career. Which I agree with 100%. Why would an aging goalie who has had a relatively illustrious career (maybe minus the playoff side) want to play for a garbage organization that has a team that, with or without Nabby, is as close to a lock for a top 3 draft pick as humanly possible? Nab prolly doesn't need the, what 300K? and would rather sit on the beaches in Cali. If I was in his shoes I would do the exact same thing.
d) Was it really in the Islander's best interests to pick up Nabby anyway? I know they want to set the record for being the worst team for the longest stretch of time (what is the opposite of a dynasty?), but they're in a close battle with the Oilers/Devils for bottom of the league. And I know teams are still supposed to try their best, but making extremely short term gains for no reason doesn't really make any sense. Stay put. Get another #1 to compliment Tavares. Who knows, in a couple of years they might climb their way back out of the AHL.
e) Or maybe the Isles just want to cement their place as the organization with the most goaltending debacles in a ten year span. These are the guys that drafted luongo as the highest goalie draft pick ever, then, before they really gave luo a chance to play, drafted Dipietro as the new highest drafted goalie ever and so famously traded luo and Oli Jokinen to the Panthers for a bag of Cheetos. They then sign Dipietro to a ridiculous 15 year contract, setting the precedent for the obscene contracts that seem commonplace today. Just to prove that karma does exist, Dipietro spends 14.9 of those years lying on a stretcher. Then last year these guys inexplicably put THREE #1 goalies on the books in Dipetro, Roloson and Biron (ok, Biron is 1b at best...). They mishandle that situation so badly that they find themselves this year playing third string goalies and trying to coax aging Russians to play for the worst team in the league.Amazingly, the Russian declines. What a comedy of errors. |
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4809 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2011 : 05:24:07
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1) Nabakov and his agent knew the waiver rules, and should have known a team other than Detroit would pick him up. If they did not anticipate this, they are idiots.
2) A team that acquires a new player has every right to suspend a player for not reporting.
A player does not report, he SHOULD BE SUSPENDED.
3) Nabakov goes to the KHL for more money and fame, falls flat on his face, and comes running back to the NHL in the foolish hopes that 29 teams will pass up his cheap services and that he can ride off in the sunset by winning the Stanley Cup with Detroit.
A struggling Islanders team claims him and he doesn't show up?
Classless, and stupid.
DO NOT THINK THAT OTHER GMs DON'T TAKE NOTICE OF THIS.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Guest9836
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Posted - 01/28/2011 : 07:44:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest5958
a) Who knows what kind of offers Nabby garnered in the off season?
b) How can you hold it against the guy for going to play in his home country?
a) + b) = no need to call him a "greedy whiny baby"
c) Have you heard/read what Nab has had to say about the situation? First off, they knew the rules and they would have to go through the waivers. And second, that it makes no sense for him to play for the Isles at this point in his career. Which I agree with 100%. Why would an aging goalie who has had a relatively illustrious career (maybe minus the playoff side) want to play for a garbage organization that has a team that, with or without Nabby, is as close to a lock for a top 3 draft pick as humanly possible? Nab prolly doesn't need the, what 300K? and would rather sit on the beaches in Cali. If I was in his shoes I would do the exact same thing.
d) Was it really in the Islander's best interests to pick up Nabby anyway? I know they want to set the record for being the worst team for the longest stretch of time (what is the opposite of a dynasty?), but they're in a close battle with the Oilers/Devils for bottom of the league. And I know teams are still supposed to try their best, but making extremely short term gains for no reason doesn't really make any sense. Stay put. Get another #1 to compliment Tavares. Who knows, in a couple of years they might climb their way back out of the AHL.
e) Or maybe the Isles just want to cement their place as the organization with the most goaltending debacles in a ten year span. These are the guys that drafted luongo as the highest goalie draft pick ever, then, before they really gave luo a chance to play, drafted Dipietro as the new highest drafted goalie ever and so famously traded luo and Oli Jokinen to the Panthers for a bag of Cheetos. They then sign Dipietro to a ridiculous 15 year contract, setting the precedent for the obscene contracts that seem commonplace today. Just to prove that karma does exist, Dipietro spends 14.9 of those years lying on a stretcher. Then last year these guys inexplicably put THREE #1 goalies on the books in Dipetro, Roloson and Biron (ok, Biron is 1b at best...). They mishandle that situation so badly that they find themselves this year playing third string goalies and trying to coax aging Russians to play for the worst team in the league.Amazingly, the Russian declines. What a comedy of errors.
Funny Funny Post, well done. |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2011 : 08:00:58
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Of course he should've been suspended, the rules are for everyone, not just a select few. Now, is he going to be blackballed by the rest of the GM's for this? Maybe, but, another year older riding on a very weak European performance, could be hard to find work. If anything, he shoud've reported and be playing so he could showcase any talent he has left to maybe earn (hear that Nabby?) the contract on a team of his choosing.
"Hockey is a man's game. The team with the most real men wins.” - Brian Burke |
Edited by - ToXXiK1 on 01/28/2011 08:02:12 |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2011 : 09:58:25
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quote:
3) Nabakov goes to the KHL for more money and fame, falls flat on his face, and comes running back to the NHL in the foolish hopes that 29 teams will pass up his cheap services and that he can ride off in the sunset by winning the Stanley Cup with Detroit.
A struggling Islanders team claims him and he doesn't show up?
Guest5958 - this is exactly why Nabby is a greedy whiny baby. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2011 : 12:24:34
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| Can't remember where i read it but i read that the Sharks were one of the teams who put a claim in for him? Anyone hear this as well or any other teams that were disclosed as interested? |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2011 : 12:50:47
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I did hear the Sharks put a bid in for him - I think I read somewhere that the list of teams that put in a waiver request was 15 or so. Thats a lot of hops to go through before DET gets him.
That would be pretty funny if the Sharks got him on waivers...I wonder if he'd play there. |
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Guest5958
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Posted - 01/28/2011 : 16:20:27
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Ok so lets break this down:
1) Nabokov is greedy because he went to play in his home country for more money. This is the same reason why all American football players that decide to play in the NFL are greedy: they could be playing in the CFL or the arena league for a fraction of the price. Greedy bastards. Myself, I determined which of my prospective employers would pay me the least and then got a job there, because I survive on rainbows and butterflies. I currently work in a sweatshop in Botswana. Oh, and to top off his greediness, he has declined to play for the Islanders, therefore forfeiting hundreds of thousands of dollars. And we all know that the only thing greedier than working for more money is not working for even more money.
2) Nabokov is whiny because, ever since the Islanders claimed him, he has been all over the media, complaining about the isles, complaining about his situation and throwing hissy fits. For shame Nabby, give it a rest already. Be a man.
3) Nabokov is a baby partly because of ALL of the whining he has been doing as outlined above, but also because he refuses to play for a team that he never agreed to play for. Everybody knows you do what you're told, whether or not it's in your best interest; otherwise you are a baby.
The truth of the matter is that if playing for more money is greed, then everybody in our society is greedy and so calling somebody greedy doesn't mean anything, and if Nabby was greedy he wouldn't care who he played for, including the Isles, as long as he got paid. Nabokov hasn't been whiny at all: he has only given one interview that I know of, in which he said no disrespect to the Islanders or their organization, but it doesn't make sense for me to play for them at this point in my career. He didn't agree to play for the Islanders, he doesn't want to play for the Islanders, it doesn't make sense for him to play for the Islanders, so he's not going to play for the Islanders. Simple as that.
In fact, I could flip your rhetoric on you 100%. You say that the Islanders were well within their rights to claim Nabokov, that if he thought no one would claim him on waivers he was an idiot and so he should just suck it up and play for them. I say that Nabokov was well within his rights to not report to the Isles, that if the Isles actually thought he would they were stupid to think so, and that they should just suck it up and release him. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2011 : 16:42:37
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quote:
In fact, I could flip your rhetoric on you 100%. You say that the Islanders were well within their rights to claim Nabokov, that if he thought no one would claim him on waivers he was an idiot and so he should just suck it up and play for them. I say that Nabokov was well within his rights to not report to the Isles, that if the Isles actually thought he would they were stupid to think so, and that they should just suck it up and release him.
Nabokov's greed is not about money - he does not need any more money, he's made nearly 33M from professional hockey. He obviously covets the championship, and wants to go to a contender - except he cannot do that in the NHL in the way that he wants to, this season. So, rather than suck it up and live by the rules of the very league he wishes to re-join, he complains and wonders why the Islanders bothered to pick him up and give him that chance.
No one claims that Nabby is not within his rights to not report, of course he is - same as any other player. There is no reason for the Islanders to think that Nabby would not play for them - when was the last time a player refused to report to a team that got him on waivers? Why wouldn't the Islanders expect a player to respect the rules of the league that he knew about before he hit the waiver wire?
Normally, players are grateful that someone actually takes them when they get put on waivers, they're grateful that they're being given a second chance by another team in the NHL, rather than going on down to the minors or out of the NHL entirely. In all cases, they never expected to be playing for the team that picked them up - its the nature of waivers.
Why does Nabokov think he's special?
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Edited by - nuxfan on 01/28/2011 16:43:08 |
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Guest5958
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Posted - 01/28/2011 : 19:42:16
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What complaining? The only comment I've seen from him is that he has nothing against the Islander organization but that it doesn't make sense for him to play there at this point, so he's staying home with his family in California. If you call that complaining, you need to spend an afternoon with my wife.
I don't think you can call the desire to win greed. And if you think the desire to win is a negative characteristic, you should be an Islander fan.
The Islanders should have known that he wouldn't be willing to play for them, because he and his agent sent out a letter to every organization in the league shortly before this whole saga ensued outlining what Nabby was looking for: he was willing to take a pay cut, but he wanted to play for a contender. The Redwings responded to this letter, and the Nabokov contract resulted. The Islanders are not a contender by any stretch of the imagination, and Snow must have known at best Nabby would play reluctantly, and that they were just about the opposite of the team he was looking to play for. Heck, I knew once I heard the Isles had claimed Nabokov that he wasn't going to play there. If it hadn't crossed their minds, they were out to lunch.
True, normally, players picked up on waivers are grateful for a chance to play in the NHL with any team. Normally, players picked up on waivers are c-level prospects. Normally, players picked up on waivers aren't fresh off a season where they were second in the league in wins, 5th in games played and 6th in save percentage. Normally, players picked up on waivers aren't Calder winners, multiple all star game attendees or vezina finalists, with 3 consecutive 40+ win seasons under their belts. We aren't talking about a career 4th liner or AHLer, or a 50 year old Chris Chelios. We are talking about an all star goaltender.
In my mind, he has earned the right to choose how he wants to proceed with his career. And in my mind, if a team that is the exact opposite of where he wants to be attempts to snatch up his contract, due to a rule whose sole purpose seems to be to provide a disincentive for Europeans to play in their home leagues, he is 100% justified in saying "Thanks, but I'm going to sit this one out and spend some time with my wife and kids in California". And that doesn't make him a whiner or a baby or any of that. It makes him a person who has decided for himself what he wants and doesn't want from his life and his career, and is taking the available measures to get there. And I can't disrespect that. |
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Guest9722
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Posted - 01/28/2011 : 20:01:59
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Its not about who he wants to play for at this point|. The rules are what they are and he was well aware that he would have to clear waivers. Sure he does not want to play for the Isles but he gave up the opportunity to pick which team he wanted to play for under his terms when he decided to play elswhere.
I highly doubt that he would have even made it to a potential contender anyways through the waiver process. All other teams knew that he wanted to go to wings. Tell me how many teams would have allowed him to just skip right to the wings........not many. I imagine most Western conf teams would have picked him up on waivers just to prevent the wings from getting him.
The same could be said about the east conf teams as well.
But to answer the question, should the Isles have suspended him? Without a doubt. He became their employee and has choosen not to report. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2011 : 22:08:54
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quote:
What complaining? The only comment I've seen from him is that he has nothing against the Islander organization but that it doesn't make sense for him to play there at this point, so he's staying home with his family in California. If you call that complaining, you need to spend an afternoon with my wife.
Yay. Thats pro sports talk for "I can't stand the thought of playing for a loser". You hear similar lame soundbites from other players all the time for nearly any situation. His agent probably wrote it for him and told him to just say it.
quote:
I don't think you can call the desire to win greed. And if you think the desire to win is a negative characteristic, you should be an Islander fan.
The desire to win is in all of us - even the Islanders. However, waiting until the season shakes out, seeing where everyone is, and then deciding you want to join the one of the heavy favourites in mid-flight...thats not a desire to win, thats a desire to attach yourself to a winner. There is a difference.
quote:
True, normally, players picked up on waivers are grateful for a chance to play in the NHL with any team. Normally, players picked up on waivers are c-level prospects. Normally, players picked up on waivers aren't fresh off a season where they were second in the league in wins, 5th in games played and 6th in save percentage. Normally, players picked up on waivers aren't Calder winners, multiple all star game attendees or vezina finalists, with 3 consecutive 40+ win seasons under their belts. We aren't talking about a career 4th liner or AHLer, or a 50 year old Chris Chelios. We are talking about an all star goaltender.
So, you're saying that the rules should be different for Nabokov. That because he is a former all-star, with 40+ win seasons, calder trophy winner, and top 10 in games played and sv%, he should somehow be able to bypass the usual rules and dictate his own future mid-season.
BTW, here is a list of some other NHL players who went on waivers in the last few years:
- Sheldon Souray (3 time all-star)
- Brian Rolston (former stanley cup champ, and all-star)
- Wade Redden (2 time all-star)
- Brendan Morrison (all-star, 11th longest ironman)
- Miroslav Sata (2 time all-star, stanley cup winner)
- Gary Roberts (3 time all-star, stanley cup winner, masterson trophy winner, likely future hall of famer)
- Martin Gerber (stanley cup winner)
There are probably more, this is all I could find in the small time I looked. So I guess waivers are not just for the "c-level prospects", they're for all players all the time.
quote:
In my mind, he has earned the right to choose how he wants to proceed with his career. And in my mind, if a team that is the exact opposite of where he wants to be attempts to snatch up his contract, due to a rule whose sole purpose seems to be to provide a disincentive for Europeans to play in their home leagues, he is 100% justified in saying "Thanks, but I'm going to sit this one out and spend some time with my wife and kids in California". And that doesn't make him a whiner or a baby or any of that. It makes him a person who has decided for himself what he wants and doesn't want from his life and his career, and is taking the available measures to get there. And I can't disrespect that.
There is nothing in this rule that stops players to play in their home countries in Europe - Nabokov could have played the entire year in Russia, and then come back to the NHL and signed as a UFA with any team that he wanted to during the summer.
This rule is there to prevent players from jumping back to the NHL when it suits them, in the middle of the season. To not have waivers in this case would allow teams to easily circumvent the cap by stockpiling players in Europe to avoid cap issues, and bringing them back just in time for the playoffs when their cap hit would be minimal. Whether you think it's vindictive or not, it is there for a very good reason and for the good of the league.
You are right about one thing though - he has definitely earned the right to choose how he wants to proceed with his career. Subject to the rules of the league he plays in of course. I have little respect for anyone that thinks they are somehow above the rules, and choose to sit it out when things don't go their way rather than playing through adversity. It says a lot about character.
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2011 : 00:51:18
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He has chose his career path, suspended in Cali......
"Hockey is a man's game. The team with the most real men wins.” - Brian Burke |
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Guest5958
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Posted - 01/29/2011 : 16:49:53
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I don't care if its pro sports talk for "I'm a baby pink elephant" and I don't care if he was told to say it by the Queen of England. My point was you've called him whiny and then said he keeps complaining, but there is zero evidence of him saying anything that can be construed as complaining whatsoever. So my point was that your claims were baseless.
I never said that the rules shouldn't apply to Nabokov. I said he was well within his rights to decide not to report to the Islanders, that I agree with his decision, and that there is no reason to deride him for making that decision.
You said that players that go through the waiver wire should be grateful just for the chance to play in the NHL again. I agree that most players that are subject to the waiver probably should be grateful, but I made the point that most players that go through waivers aren't the same caliber of player that Nabokov is. The kind of player that should be grateful just for the chance to play in the NHL, regardless of the circumstances or terms, is a marginal NHL player, ie, someone who, based on their talents, is lucky to be in the NHL at all, and are lucky that any team actually wants to take a chance on them. That doesn't apply to Nabokov, who, according to you, had half of the teams in the NHL put in claims when he hit waivers.
Now, I realized that players that had once been good but had now advanced in age to the point that they became marginal NHL players could also be prone to being put on waivers, which is what I was alluding to when I said "Nabokov is not a 50 year old Chris Chelios". The players you listed have something in common: all of them (with the exception of Gerber, who doesn't belong on the list, won a stanley cup as a back up, and has spent most of his career in the minors) are players whose best play was several years behind them and most of them were under contracts where they were being significantly overpaid due to their previous play. So if Miroslav Satan, who is 8 years removed from any all star game and just finished a campaign with the Bruins in which he netted 14 points on the season, was put on waivers and was claimed by the Islanders, and he said "I only want to play for team x", I would say, Satan, you should be grateful that any team in the NHL wants you because at this point in your career you are a marginal player and if you want to play in the NHL at this point you can't do so according to your own terms anymore. But Nabokov doesn't have to be grateful for the opportunity to play in the NHL. He was putting up elite goalie numbers last season. He belongs in the NHL, and when players of his caliber exercise their right not to play in our league, to play in other leagues instead, it is to the detriment of the NHL. Which is why I feel cheated as a fan when players like Nabokov or Radulov, who belong in the NHL, go over to the KHL.
So Nabokov came back to the NHL with the intent to play for a contender. Just like Hossa, when he went to Pittsburgh, and then Detriot, and then Chicago. Or Ray Bourque, when he said so long Boston, I want to win a cup before I retire. The only difference is Nabokov was at the mercy of the waiver wire, and had the audacity to believe that teams would respect his wishes to play for something resembling a contending team, and that no one would pick up an elite goaltender at an entry level salary.
To summarize my position: I believe that Nabokov, at this point in his career, has every right to want to play for a contending team. I believe he went about doing so in a naive way. I believe that the Islanders had every right to claim Nabokov, but they must have known he would have reservations about playing there. I believe it makes no sense for Nabokov to play for the Islanders, and I support his decision not to report to the team. I don't consider him not reporting to the Islanders proof that he thinks he is above the rules or anything like that, just that he was put in a position that he never agreed to be in, and in fact stated that he was looking for the exact opposite. And I believe that if the Islanders hold him to this contract next year, he will be playing in the KHL next year. And I believe that is not in the best interests of the NHL. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2011 : 20:17:45
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quote:
To summarize my position: I believe that Nabokov, at this point in his career, has every right to want to play for a contending team. I believe he went about doing so in a naive way. I believe that the Islanders had every right to claim Nabokov, but they must have known he would have reservations about playing there. I believe it makes no sense for Nabokov to play for the Islanders, and I support his decision not to report to the team. I don't consider him not reporting to the Islanders proof that he thinks he is above the rules or anything like that, just that he was put in a position that he never agreed to be in, and in fact stated that he was looking for the exact opposite. And I believe that if the Islanders hold him to this contract next year, he will be playing in the KHL next year. And I believe that is not in the best interests of the NHL.
To quote Mick Jagger - you can't always get what you want. Everyone that goes on waivers gets put into a position that they didn't agree to - thats waivers. The NHL is a revolving door of players, people come and people go. He had a chance to sign a contract last summer and elected to chase the money in Russia - the world moves on. I don't for one second believe that Nabby playing in the NHL somehow makes the NHL better - he's just one guy.
One thing is for sure, Nabby is now in control of his destiny, both this year and next. Its up to him how he wants to proceed. I think its clear at this point that he's not going to be playing for DET this year - unless NYI back off their position, put him back on waivers, and the other x teams allow him through waivers the rest of the way. And honestly, at this point, I think someone that is a semi-contender would probably grab him and suspend him in the event he didn't report, just so he didn't get to DET in time for the playoffs - paying 250K to prevent a rival from getting the goaltender they need is not a hard decision to make in today's NHL.
It would be so easy for him to finish the year with NYI, and then sign with whoever he wants as a UFA with no waiver issues next summer - any contender that he wants, no hassles. He'll be 36 this summer, he has 3 or 4 good playing years left, its not like he has to do it all this year. Why do you think he doesn't want to go down that path? |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2011 : 23:42:09
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IMO, he'll never play for Detroit! They want him now, they may not need him next year or anytime thereafter.
No way the other teams in the west, below Det in the standings, in position for playoffs, let them get him! NO WAY!!! |
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The Duke
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1239 Posts |
Posted - 01/30/2011 : 15:32:12
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This guy has an opportunity to play in the best ice hockey league in the world...hands down, after walking away from it...and instead of playing he balks at it !!!!!!!!!!!!!
Does he realize how many have dreamed of playing in that league, never having the skill set to do so. He has the tools and slaps the NYI in the face.....what an a$$ - hole....
Does he realize how many 30 year old goalies are still playing in the minors and would give their right nut to play for the NYI ??????.....guess you can read my opinion of NABBBBBY.
p.s...i also lost a lot of respect for the Kipper during the Olympics pre-games when he told Finnish upper management that......if he wasn`t going to be the number 1 starter for certain,,,,,he would not play for their Olympic team !!!! Who the hell does this guy think he is ?? P.Roy or M.Brodeur.....what have you done Kipper besides that one good playoff year ?
Can you imagine, as a common person, having the chance to play in the Olympics and setting ultimatums ?? Personally i would have told him that if thats the way he feels abot his country....STAT HOME AND WATCH IT ON TV !!! |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 01/31/2011 : 05:46:47
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Guest 5958:
Boy, do you ever miss the point.
Nabakov LEFT THE NHL. That means, he has lost EVERY accomodation and luxury afforded to him as an established veteran with a very good record/history. He CHOSE to leave the NHL, and he CHOSE to not report to the Islanders.
He wants to be able to snub the NHL, and come back and win a Stanley Cup perhaps? Fat chance, bud . . . he forfeited his right to be a prima donna, and now he will pay the price. Actions speak louder than words, and although you or I probably haven't heard one real sentence from Nabakov ever that wasn't a sound byte for public consumption, his actions say to me: WHINY PRIMA DONNA.
He made his bed, and he is sleeping in it.
As someone stated earlier - how easy would it have been to play a few months for the Isles, then get a contract in the summer? For a now failed KHL player, he seriously needs a reality check - and he'll get it, I wager.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Guest2429
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Posted - 01/31/2011 : 17:59:54
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I question if guest 5958 has a real clue what he is talking about.
He got into a hissy fit because San Jose dropped him and nothing else looked promising as all of the "contenders" had their goalie situation addressed. He goes to the KHL to get some more money/glory whatever, he left because he was pissed off.
Then he plays totaly lackluster in the KHL and he either asks to be released, or is offered one for whatever reason, wasnt it "family issues" at the outset, man he sure solved those failry sonn didnt he.
Then he wants to come spweeping back into the NHL with a team that now needs him because of injuries to one of thier star goalies, and he is all ready and raring to go, family problems solved, bitterness with the NHL gone etc.
He KNOWS tha this rule is in place, he is CRAZY if he thinks that no other team will grab him on waivers, I mean there are currently what at least 8 clubs that have a major problem with goalie injuries alone let alone, stars who arent playing up to expected levels ( although I think that would only be about another 3 or 4 clubs at most)
Then he wont play because he wants a chance at a Cup.
So stop getting hung up on "whiny" or "crybaby"
When you break it down he wanted it his way, and much Like Lindros and and the NOrdiques sitaution, if he cant have it his way then screw the league and its rules. A player like thats shouldnt be getting a chance to play in the NHL no matter how skilled, and hopefully Nabokov finishes his career in the minors as a washout |
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MyTeamRules
Top Prospect
72 Posts |
Posted - 01/31/2011 : 19:45:31
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No this was not the right thing to do. If he didn't report to any top 22 team then this should be done, but the NYI should relize that a 1 year contract for a team that can't even make the playoffs is rediculous. Also Nabby needs to prove he can not only take a team for 10th to 8th but that he can play in the playoffs.
Is it just me or is this NYI GM just attempting to wreck the NHL, the only reason I can understand he is not investing in many players is that he thinks he will have to give Schremp, Okoposo, and Tavares 3M + contracts. And even that is pushing the limits. If any one has any more points on paragraph 2 I would very much like to hear opinions on this matter.
”If you've only got one day to live, come see the Toronto Maple Leafs. It'll seem like forever. ” - Pat |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 01/31/2011 : 22:02:08
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| the contents of paragraph 2 would constitute a new topic, and hence a new thread. If you want to discuss it, feel free to start one. |
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Guest2427
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Posted - 02/01/2011 : 14:05:44
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I get "hung up" on things that people write that have absolutely no basis in fact. Even more so when they don't actually even have a basis in common sense.
I like the NHL too. I'm a fan. But I'm not shortsighted enough to believe that everybody holds the NHL in such a cherished position, especially players that are born outside of North America. So when a player leaves the NHL to play in the KHL for allegedly more money, you say "OMG, how could they not be playing in the NHL when given a chance? They must be "pissed off"/"bitter"/whatever". Whereas I say it makes perfect sense for a player to play in their country of origin for more money, and I am lead to question your ability to properly attribute motives to actions.
I don't think it requires anger or bitterness to play in your home country for more money. I think it requires common sense and a rudimentary idea of economics.
Now, a player might decide to play in a country other than their origin for less money than they could get elsewhere if there are other compelling reasons to do so. Such as playing on a half-decent team with at least a marginal chance at some post-season success. Now to the extent that that is not possible, that a player could only play for less money in a country other than their origin on a team that has zero chance at a championship, it is 100% reasonable for that player to say "I cannot agree to these terms, thanks but no thanks". And once again, that does not require the player to be angry or bitter, just to have a different set of priorities than you.
You guys are so in love with the NHL that you can't conceive of the possibility that someone might have different priorities, that their highest goal might not be just playing on any old team in the NHL. Try learning some empathy.
And perhaps I am missing your point, because your point seems to be based in irrationality. You guys think Nabokov was given the privilege to play in the NHL, that he refused to do so unconditionally and that this is proof of some kind of character flaw. My point was merely that Nabokov had different priorities than what you might have, that the Islander deal simply wasn't in his best interests, that it was perfectly within his rights not to report to the Isles and that that doesn't automatically make him a jerkoff.
And while it might have been easy enough for him to play for the Isles for a couple of months and then hit free agency, playing in the NHL is not the pinnacle achievement for him. If Nabokov is offered more money to play in his home country again next year, guess what: he's probably going to go play in the KHL again.
Oh and this little bump in the road doesn't mean Nabokov will "finish his career in the minors". If he would't play for the Islanders, what on Earth makes you think he would play in the minors?
I don't necessarily think you guys don't "get the point". I just think you lack perspective. That's all. |
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Guest4803
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Posted - 02/01/2011 : 15:40:11
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| They have the right to suspend him, but like others have said do you honestly think the Islanders organization expected him to show up? if they did they should give their head a shake, he obviously wanted to play for a contender hence why he signed with detroit (most desirable team as voted by the players) he knew he was going to be put on waivers and that more then likely someone was going to claim him and if they werent to his liking (islanders were voted least desirable team to play for) he was going to sit out and not report. Now there stuck with him they can either put him back on waivers or deal him to the redwings..(dont think they are able to trade him to anyone else due to him being claimed from the wings) |
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Guest0288
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Posted - 02/01/2011 : 16:19:58
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| nabokov is a goalie |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2011 : 16:23:01
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest0288
nabokov is a goalie
Your point being?  |
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Nucksyear
Top Prospect
1 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2011 : 16:49:12
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| If Snow didn't take him, NYI fans should b totally po'd. That's business. Snow probably would have showcased him for a trade anyways. Nabby got bad advice, gave it a shot and can live on a beach (probably under a rock) wondering what could of been. DESERVES IT! We've heard all the rhymes and reasons but all it boils down to is wishing he was on a winning team for all the marbels.................shoulda stayed with the Sharks. Nuff said on this subject. Guest5958 must be his NEW agent, eh? |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2011 : 20:37:41
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quote:
I get "hung up" on things that people write that have absolutely no basis in fact. Even more so when they don't actually even have a basis in common sense.
what facts are we missing here? All the facts are known:
- Nabby had offers in the NHL last summer, at substantially lower values than he was willing to play for
- Nabby left the NHL for more money with the KHL
- his KHL team let him go for "family reasons"
- he wants back into the NHL to play for DET, a contender, and signed a very low value 1 year deal to do so
- he went through waivers, knowing full well the wiaver rules
- he was picked up by NYI, who were well within their rights to do so, and seemed to be legitimately acting in the best interests of their team (ie, not malice). Just like any other team picking up a player on waivers.
- he refused to report to NYI
Everything else - including most of your post - is opinion and editorial. This whole thread is opinion, as the original question is open-ended.
And it does seem you are missing the point. No one is down on Nabby for going home to Russia to play for more money - good on him, someone at home gave him the money he wanted, and he went after it, we all understand the "rudimentary economics" of his decision. Players make that decision every year.
People are down on Nabby for simply thinking that he can come back when things go bad in Russia and dictate his situation in the league - regardless of the rules that the league has in place. And when things don't go according to "his priorities", he chooses not to report. He obviously cares more about getting his own way and playing for a contender than the league as a whole - so why should the league care much about him and what he wants?
Why should NYI un-suspend him and throw him back on waivers? They need a goalie, they got one on waivers, and they're not letting him go - they have every right to try to have their "asset" come around, and are in no danger of losing him.
It is no different than a contract dispute with an RFA that has no arbitration rights - the team that owns his rights can take as long as they need for the player to come around, because the player has no other recourse. Would we all suddenly feel sympathy for the RFA because the team was not moving him or putting him on waivers and allowing him to play where he wanted to play?
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Edited by - nuxfan on 02/01/2011 20:38:53 |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2011 : 20:59:55
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| What do you guys think would have happened if Detroit had offered him more money? I don't know how much cap space they had, but had they made it pricier, would NYI or any other teams have bitten? I'm still thinking some teams would have, but perhaps it'd have been playoff teams and i wonder if he'd have reported, lets say to a team like Chicago? |
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WhiteBread9
Top Prospect
Canada
6 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2011 : 21:09:45
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I don't blame Nabokov at all for not wanting to play for the Islanders.
1) The Islanders were recently voted as the franchise that 27% of all NHL players would least like to play for. That pretty much speaks for itself.
2) They are the worst NHL team of the decade. They have no chance of getting anywhere near a playoff spot within the next 5 seasons. They are constantly trading away good talent and getting virtually nothing in return. They also havent drafted a servicable NHLer other than John Tavares, Kyle Okposo, or Blake Comeau since 2000. Why would anyone want to play for a team with no future. Playing for the Islanders is the equivalent to working at McDonalds.
3) Nabokov actually HAS earned the right to dictate his career path, you don't just lose your credentials because you left the league for half a season. And would someone please tell me how a goalie goes from being the starting goalie for Russia in the Olympics, second in the NHL in wins, and sixth in save percentage to being a marginal player who should be greatful that the Islanders want him to play for them! That is simply absurd, this guy is a top 5 goalie in the league and you say he should be greatful to play for the Islanders!? And I hardly doubt he regrets his decision, his KHL team is still paying him his contract and hes sitting on a beach in Cali! Thats not a bad life if you ask me |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2011 : 21:32:29
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quote:
Originally posted by WhiteBread9
Playing for the Islanders is the equivalent to working at McDonalds.
BINGO!!! Finally some truth! There are similarities here. You see, if he played for the Islanders OR if he worked at McDonalds, he'd get a free ugly uniform!!!  |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2011 : 22:36:59
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quote:
Nabokov actually HAS earned the right to dictate his career path, you don't just lose your credentials because you left the league for half a season
Actually, you do lose that right - at least for the duration of the contract which he signed to get back into the NHL - if you want to play in the NHL again.
The people that think the NYI are in the wrong here constantly point to Nabby's credentials - this has nothing to do with credentials. Whether or not Nabby plays for NYI or DET or never again in the NHL, he'll still be a great goalie with great NHL stats.
HOWEVER, because he chose to come back to the NHL in the middle of the season, when he started the season elsewhere, and then got picked up on waivers, if he wants to continue his career in the NHL, he must do one of the following:
- play the remainder of the seaon with NYI, then sign with anyone as a UFA in the summer
- sit out the remainder of the season, and possibly the next season as well (if NYI elects to hold him to the contract thru next season), then sign with anyone in the summer of 2012.
- hope that NYI puts him back on waivers, and he eventually gets picked up by a team that he actually wants to play for.
Whether or not he wants to play for NYI is irrelevant at this point - they own his rights for the remainder of the season and possibly next season as well.
quote:
What do you guys think would have happened if Detroit had offered him more money? I don't know how much cap space they had, but had they made it pricier, would NYI or any other teams have bitten? I'm still thinking some teams would have, but perhaps it'd have been playoff teams and i wonder if he'd have reported, lets say to a team like Chicago?
I think the reason that he was so popular was largely due to the contract size - its an attractive amount and fits under nearly every team's cap. Had you told a team that they could have Nabby's services for a pro-rated 500K in September, you'd have had 25 teams wanting to take a bite for sure.
I also think that he has a small list of teams that he would be willing to "suffer through" if he could not get to DET - pretty much any of the perceived top-6 teams in his mind. |
Edited by - nuxfan on 02/01/2011 22:37:42 |
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Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2011 : 23:49:52
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Can Someone please explain how the Islanders are going to hold his contract for next season. As far as I can tell there really isn't any right or reason for that.
CANUCKS RULE!!!
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2011 : 02:03:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Canucks Man
Can Someone please explain how the Islanders are going to hold his contract for next season. As far as I can tell there really isn't any right or reason for that.
CANUCKS RULE!!!
I believe due to not reporting and the subsequent suspension, the NYI still have him for the following year. If he showed and played, he was a free man next season.
"Hockey is a man's game. The team with the most real men wins.” - Brian Burke |
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Topic |
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Should the Islanders have Suspended Nabokov? 
