| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Guest7924
( )
|
 Posted - 04/26/2011 : 10:31:17
|
I've played hochey all my life and I've suffered multiple concussions. At the time concussions weren't viewed as being that serious of an issue. You more or less just had you're "bell rung" and we're told to get back out there and play.
Now I find myself split when it comes to Sidney Crosby. I understand that concussions are serious and players who have recieved multiple concussions often have there careers end early (LaFontaine, Lindros) but as a Penguins fan I feel Crosby needs to suck it up already and get back out there for Game 7. I don't understannd how Mario's bravery hasn't worn off on this kids. The guy played with Hodgkin's lymphoma and a herniated disc in his back often requiring trainers to tie his skates. Crosby has been off for almost 4 months with his bruised melon. Time to grow a pair bud, stop being call Sid the Kid and become Sid the Man...
|
|
|
Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2011 : 11:00:08
|
Oh my.....i'm not even gonna comment on this.  |
 |
|
|
leigh
Moderator
Canada
1755 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2011 : 11:05:27
|
Actually, I think this is a fair concern. growing up in the 70's and 80's we did play through concussions and frankly I don't know anyone out of the thousands of players I've met that has suffered long term dama.......
Actually, I think this is a fair concern. growing up in the 70's and 80's we did play through concussions and frankly I don't know anyone out of the thousands of players I've met that has suffered long term dama.....
Actually.... |
|
|
|
Pushrod
Top Prospect
Canada
44 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2011 : 11:34:12
|
Apparently you can restrain yourself easier than me Alex. These are simply ignorant comments from people who don't understand the developments of medicine that didn't exist in the '70's and 80's'. And I'm not just talking about diagnosing the conditions, it also refers to post-mortem analysis which has been furthered by athletes donating their brains to science. Not sure how old the guest is but your profile says 36 Leigh. I'm guessing most of your friends are around your age or maybe a bit older at best. The consequences may yet come considering you're still decently young, one never knows.
Professional athletes in hockey and football, the two main sports involved in this 'controversy', must play day in and day out against the best of the best in regards to skill, speed and size. The excess damage that can be done in a situation like that cannot be underestimated. If an athlete wants to look after his health I'm not going to berate him for it and tell him to be a man. I don't feel the need to go around and say "my brain has more damage than yours" so I'm more of a man. My chest full of hair and inability to win an argument with my wife already tells me I'm a guy. |
|
|
|
Guest2119
( )
|
Posted - 04/26/2011 : 12:01:16
|
These athletes also make MILLIONS of dollars to play a game where they know there are significant health risks. They cash the cheque, they accept the risks.
Crosby's been participating in full contact team practices for 2 weeks now.
How much of this is the Penguins trying to make a statement to the NHL about headshots, or about protecting Crosby himself?
I agree, take your time and come back right. But it's been 4 months since those hits. Seabrook came back two games later this playoffs.
Now, Crosby's team, and his fans need him. He should stop playing Charlie Conway with that stupid headset, and get out there and win the game for his team. That's what he's being paid to do. |
|
|
|
Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2011 : 12:49:54
|
quote:
Originally posted by leigh
Actually, I think this is a fair concern. growing up in the 70's and 80's we did play through concussions and frankly I don't know anyone out of the thousands of players I've met that has suffered long term dama.......
Actually, I think this is a fair concern. growing up in the 70's and 80's we did play through concussions and frankly I don't know anyone out of the thousands of players I've met that has suffered long term dama.....
Actually....
lol hahaha loves it!
Crosby has shown guts if he doesn't play it is simply to dangerous to his health ask Marc Savard if he should have come back last year?
"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
|
|
|
|
Pushrod
Top Prospect
Canada
44 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2011 : 12:55:49
|
I take my comment to you back leigh. Nicely done  I read the messages quickly through the first time and obviously didn't pick up on the cleverness.......it's my knee-jerk reaction to you having a Flames avatar I guess. |
|
|
|
Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2011 : 13:05:49
|
Kidding aside, no person's quality of life is worth a game. Ever. Crosby could come back early, get hit, and lose not only his career but also the quality of his life for the rest of this life.
How can you compare coming back from cancer to a concussion? Could Mario's lymphoma get worse if he played hockey???
That is a sick, sick opinion.
Very well said Leigh. |
Edited by - Beans15 on 04/26/2011 14:28:43 |
|
|
|
Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2011 : 13:28:39
|
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Kidding aside, no persons quality of life is worth a game. Ever. Crosby could come back early, get hit, and lose not only his career but also the quality of his life for the rest of this life.
How can you compare coming back from cancer to a concussion. Could Mario's lymphoma get worse if he played hockey???
That is a sick, sick opinion.
Very well said Leigh.
exactly i read an article on Keith Primeau a while back who is only in his early 40's and he can't stand in loud rooms or coach his kids hockey and his personal life is very limited due to all the head trauma....
there is a lot of years (hopfully) to live after hockey.,, it would be a shame for hockey and mostly for Crosby to come back in the playoffs after sitting out for 4 months and gets knocked out again because he is not up to speed with the game then all of a sudden he's not ready for next season and then halfway through comes back and he isn't scoring as much,,, wait then he gets run into the boards again and all of a sudden one of the leagues best best players may never come back with years of great hockey in him. (sound familiar we saw this exact scenario this year it is a very probable scenario)
"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
|
|
|
|
n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2011 : 20:51:40
|
I won't openly condemn guest 7924 for having these thoughts . . . he was being honest and forthright, and he has every right to this opinion. I have heard the same from quite a few hockey guys . . . guys I know and respect to a certain degree because they know hockey a bit better than I do in many aspects of the game and its culture.
But as you see guest, the culture has changed.
Tough guys are celebrated and respected . . . but making smart moves in regards to your future safety and the working of your brain is just . . . seen as smart. It's a smart move not to want to have scrambled brains, nausea when doing heavy lifting, and a need to stay in the shade for long periods of time. It's seen as clever not to have memory lapses worthy of an 80 year old alzheimer's sufferer at the age of 40. It seems like good planning not to want to have constant migraines.
No, Crosby is all right, all right . . . he's thinking straight, and it seems like, taking good advice. Good on him for it.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
|
|
|
Guest4534
( )
|
Posted - 04/27/2011 : 07:07:32
|
Maybe in the 70's,80's,players were tough when they had concussions and came back in the game after taking smelling salts.Today these guys have ringing in their head,have a hard time staying focussed,talking,just keeping up with today's events is a chore.You go from a very successful person,to someone who lives in a cloudy environment.
In hockey you try to separate the opponent from the puck by playing the puck first,with your stick,then finish your check.Hockey is not about separating the opponent's head from his shoulder.You see this every night on T.V. and most checks warrant a penalty,because they don't play the puck first.
Kids are quitting the greatest game in the world because this lack of respect from other players.They are smart and they know there are many other sports available to them.
Sidney should take his time,and even hang up his skates.When he comes back he will be vulnerable and will be the target of many players.Not the talented players,but those who can't stop unless there is a board there.
In leaving,those of you who could not make the backyard rink teams,don't judge and say someone is a coward unless you plyed in the show and have had severe concussions.Well,back to my cloudy world. |
|
|
|
Guest4050
( )
|
Posted - 04/27/2011 : 08:12:15
|
Well Guest as a die hard & long time Pen's fan myself, I actually love Crosby & Malkin sitting out & have no desire for them to be rushed back. Not only have we seen the compete level of our entire team & young players, we know exactly what we have going fwd, which includes many more yrs of a healthy malkin & Crosby. It's not like our window to capture a cup is closing like a Washington / Van who get there and then come up short. We won just two yrs ago & i'd sooner win 1 - 4 cups over the next 10yrs then rush him back & cripple our franchise for the next 10. Win or lose tonight its an epic battle by our heart & soul guys who have proven to everyone else the depth we indeed have & how scary we will continue to be going fwd with a healthy team.
As far as concussions are concerned talk to qb's such as Jim McMahon who can't recall his championship victory & half his career, look up info on Terry Bradshaw (ya the same one you see every sunday) & how he has to do speech therapy cuz his melon is so mushed there are many times he has brain laps thus the reasoning FOX only gives him short & quick blurts. As far as hockey, feel free to see how as some mentioned Primeau, Savard, The Lindros bros & many ole timers who's lives have been ruined do to their pride & the public notion that they are soft to prolong an injury as oppose to battling with their teammates.
We are talking about a 23yr kid who has proven his talents are superior to everone else, why ruin 15 more yrs of watching him play over the hope of him putting on a show for 1 - 25gms then asking Mario where he lives  Also as far as your mario point, had Mario taken time off in his prime to rest his back maybe we would be having the convo when he would of caught some of Gretzky's records as oppose to woulda shoulda coulda been the best. Enjoy what we've had & what have to look fwd to not the dissappointment of maybe not succeeding for 1 season. |
|
|
|
Mario 66
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
360 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2011 : 09:13:16
|
My apoligies above was me
In youth we learn; in age we understand |
|
|
|
Guest7924
( )
|
Posted - 04/27/2011 : 09:28:36
|
I understand the dangers of concussions and I respect a player’s decision to remain out as long as it takes for them to feel physically and mentally fit.
Perhaps my original statement was a bit emotional because I know Crosby could make a huge difference to this team even at 70% especially on the Penguins dry power play.
I just think personally I'd have a real hard time staying put while my friends and teammates battled out there and watching Dave Bolland and Seabrook battle back for their concussions makes it all the more frustrating.
And Beans not sure how you could consider my opinion sick? Perhaps if I said Crosby likes to diddle Timbits hockey players that might be considered sick...but because I compared two severe injuries/illnesses and compete levels of two similar players?
Grow up!
|
|
|
|
fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2011 : 14:39:26
|
Perhaps it's because you made the comparisons based on your opinion, and not anything factual, which I too find somewhat disturbing. As much a testament to Lemieux's character and bravery it was, to even come back to hockey after battling his illness, being a 2 time lymphoma battler and survivor myself, I at least can speak with some knowledge of what is involved.
Depending on the level of the illness and the debilitation of the treatments, normal life is attainable fairly readily. Much like a concussion.
Had Mario not returned, no one would have questioned his character or his commitment, because we are all led to believe in the potential severity of his illness at the time, yet, without knowing any details on the actual extent and severity of Crosby's, he should, in your words;
"suck it up already and get back out there for Game 7"
"Time to grow a pair bud, stop being call Sid the Kid and become Sid the Man"
There is nothing at all un-manly about ensuring one's future health is in order, rather than satisfy a rather pedestrian, in the big picture, goal of playoff success.
That would be sick. |
|
|
|
Awesome One
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
505 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2011 : 16:08:00
|
He's the best player in the frikkin game, they don't wan't to take risks.
Plus, they're doing fine without him.
Making the world more awesome, one step at a time! |
|
|
|
Guest9504
( )
|
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 11:52:37
|
I agree with guest 7924. To lose game seven by one goal?!? Crosby should have played. If you can practice for weeks then you could have played 10 or 20 minutes and tried to make a difference.
I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT WHEN WE PAY THESE GUYS MULTIMILLION DOLLARS PER YEAR THAT THEY ARE ENTITLED TO FOLLOW THE SAME RULES AS A REGULAR PERSON. They sure as hell don't have to follow the same rules when they aren't on the ice so why now. They are paid gladiators who battle for our entertainment. They get paid the amounts they do because their careers are short due to the tough nature of it. If we make it easy for them then why should we have to pay them at this ludicris level. Either you are a celebrity or you are not. Make up your mind!
In my opinion, the Penguins management admitted defeat by holding Crosby back from playing. What kind of message does this send to the rest of the team? Rediculous!
Now I expect a full blast from people here but please do not make this personal. I did not attack any of you. I am not stupid or ignorant i have a different opinion and it too is valid, if not politically correct. |
|
|
|
Mario 66
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
360 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 12:22:29
|
It is society that puts athletes on a pedistol & pays their wages. If you don't want them to make so much don't show up, but to try and explain why it is one obligation to risk their well being to please someone else is RIDICULOUS!!!!
ENOUGH SAID!!
In youth we learn; in age we understand |
|
|
|
Guest9504
( )
|
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 12:36:29
|
Well since you said ENOUGH SAID.
The whole reason they get paid this much is that they are in a risky business and they will not be able to make big money for a long period of time. Take ti while you can get it.
Now we hold their hands and tell them that they can just take thier time because there is apossibility that they could get hurt again. No kidding! They play a contact sport they could get hurt. And they play it for wages we can only dream of. It is wrong. We are so damn politically corret these days because we all drink the same kool aid. and people are afraid to speak up out of fear or reprisal. I work my ass off everyday whether I am sick, tired or injured, just to make ends meet. And these primadonnas get a hang nail and sit on the sidelines. Granted a concussion is a serious injury and a player should be given adequate time to recover the same as any other injury, but he's had it. If he can practice regularly then he can play 10 to 20 minutes in one game to give their team a shot. Maurice Richard is rolling over in his grave right now. |
|
|
|
Mario 66
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
360 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 12:59:48
|
Guest, Not attempted to be a personal attack so please do not take it as that just general statement
News flash their called VP's PRES CEO"S, COO'S, ENTREPENEURS, DIRECTORS', Doctor's Lawyers etc. Those who invested yrs in school like these athletes who invested yrs in their trade to ensure they could have the finer things in life & not have to bust their ass til their 60. There are bad breaks in life, but nobody holds these guys hands. If they don't produce they don't have a job and rather then complaining about how we bust our ass; we do have the option to do something about it (Stocks, entrepeneurship, further educate one's self) There are always options we as a society just sooner bitch about our shortcomings then put in the effort to rectify them.
A concussion can lead to permanent brain damage do you feel playing one game would be worth not recognizing your parents, wives or children for the rest of your life?? There are moments I agree with you when some guys are soft (Vince Carter) and abuse the privledges they have, but when it comes to your brain there is no situation or number of dollar's worth risking it.
In youth we learn; in age we understand |
|
|
|
nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 13:01:19
|
quote:
The whole reason they get paid this much is that they are in a risky business and they will not be able to make big money for a long period of time. Take ti while you can get it.
The whole reason they get paid this much is because
a) there are very few people on the planet that can do what they do, at the level they do it
b) we as a population throw a great deal of money towards entertaining ourselves.
Sid's paycheque has nothing to do with him risking his life and health. Professional golfers can make more than Crosby. Top tennis players make more than Crosby. Some cricket players make more than Crosby. None of them ever have to worry about being hit in the head by a fellow athlete or crushed into the stanchon at full speed.
Hockey is what it is, and like other contact sports, you sometimes get injured. And you don't come back and play until you're healthy. And if you don't get healthy, you stop playing altogether. There is no implied rule in hockey that dictates you play through any injury you get. |
|
|
|
fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 13:06:41
|
Guest9504,
We have no right to ask anyone to to risk their health for any reason, money especially, for a sport/entertainment even more so.
This is a sport, this is entertainment, and yes, they are paid exorbitantly to play a game, but that is the fault of all of us collectively. We want what a smart bunch of businessman have seen as a luxury item that can be charged for accordingly, and that is that. I would think that you would find that the majority of NHL players play for a substantial love of the game, the money and lifestyle are bonuses. To compare their recompense to the rest of us is a moot point, and because we have our societal structure of who makes what so screwed up, probably best left for another thread.
Would you ask a kid on a minor hockey team to suck it up and get out there and take a chance with their future standard of normal life over a playoff game? Of course not, I would hope, yet because once a person becomes a celebrity or a professional athlete, the standards of morality change? Ridiculous.
By all means, have an opinion, but don't try to disguise what sounds like ignorance, as one.
I have made edits to this from the original post, to not have it sound like a personal attack, only a strong rebuttal to what I think is a very innapproriate opinion, and that is what I have issue with, not you or your intelligence, I doubt no one's intelligence or integrity until they give reason too. |
Edited by - fat_elvis_rocked on 04/28/2011 15:24:36 |
|
|
|
Guest9504
( )
|
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 13:13:38
|
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
[quote]
Hockey is what it is, and like other contact sports, you sometimes get injured. And you don't come back and play until you're healthy. And if you don't get healthy, you stop playing altogether. There is no implied rule in hockey that dictates you play through any injury you get.
Well you're supporting my point that players are in it for themselves and not their team/city/country etc. They play when they want to and under their own terms unlike the rest of the world. and we call them heros. And you said it yourself we pay them because we want to be entertained. If we paid them 100 grand a year I could understand because they need to ensure that they can make money to survive for the next 50 years. But when you make 80x that in one season then I think you have an obligation to us fans to get out there and entertain. He's not going to die if he gets another concussion. So you get some headaches and forget your car keys from time to time, I have friends who could barely afford to feed their daughters enough nutrition through their formative years and who knows the long term damage that has caused them.
Again, I'm not saying he shouldn't be given time after a concussion to heal. I'm just saying that if he can practice for weeks he can play a few minutes. No one seems willing to address this. Obviously the management of the team didn't ahve any faith that their team could come close to winning. |
|
|
|
Guest9504
( )
|
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 13:21:26
|
quote:
Originally posted by fat_elvis_rocked
Thanks for the rant Dr. 9504,
You must be an MD to be able to make such broad conjectures regarding where Crosby is at in his recovery.
Are you for real? I understand an opinion that is not politically correct is still an opinion, but at times, an opinion can be mistaken for the ignorance it really is.
We have no right to ask anyone to to risk their health for any reason, money especially, for a sport/entertainment even more so.
This is a sport, this is entertainment, and yes, they are paid exorbitantly to play a game, but that is the fault of all of us collectively. We want what a smart bunch of businessman have seen as a luxury item that can be charged for accordingly, and that is that. I would think that you would find that the majority of NHL players play for a substantial love of the game, the money and lifestyle are bonuses. To compare their recompense to the rest of us is a moot point, and because we have our societal structure of who makes what so screwed up, probably best left for another thread.
Would you ask a kid on a minor hockey team to suck it up and get out there and take a chance with their future standard of normal life over a playoff game? Of course not, I would hope, yet because once a person becomes a celebrity or a professional athlete, the standards of morality change? Ridiculous.
By all means, have an opinion, but don't try to disguise ignorance as one.
I reread your post, and I realize that this may sound like a personal attack, but it is a strong rebuttal to what I think is a very innapproriate opinion, and that is what I have issue with, not you or your intelligence, I doubt no one's intelligence or integrity until they give reason too.
Here come the personal attack and look at who is leading the charge. I'm not offended though, I've been on this site for a long time and I know you are famous for them. Disguised in wit and humour so as not to catch the eyes of the police. Sorry was that personal?
And regarding your comment about a kid in minor hockey, of course I wouldn't. Please try to keep your points relevant to the topic and not some far reaching statement that tries to resemble a retort. I am talking about professional athletes making millions at our expense. Little Johnny is safe from my venemous ignorance. |
|
|
|
freddyboy
Rookie
Canada
218 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 13:27:17
|
quote:
Originally posted by Guest9504
Well since you said ENOUGH SAID.
The whole reason they get paid this much is that they are in a risky business and they will not be able to make big money for a long period of time. Take ti while you can get it.
Now we hold their hands and tell them that they can just take thier time because there is apossibility that they could get hurt again. No kidding! They play a contact sport they could get hurt. And they play it for wages we can only dream of. It is wrong. We are so damn politically corret these days because we all drink the same kool aid. and people are afraid to speak up out of fear or reprisal. I work my ass off everyday whether I am sick, tired or injured, just to make ends meet. And these primadonnas get a hang nail and sit on the sidelines. Granted a concussion is a serious injury and a player should be given adequate time to recover the same as any other injury, but he's had it. If he can practice regularly then he can play 10 to 20 minutes in one game to give their team a shot. Maurice Richard is rolling over in his grave right now.
a bit off topic but what about some baseball players, they are paid 25 millions a year and tell me it's a contact sports? they could get hurt? they have huge wages also so your point is only half working.....
joe is a god, if u dont agree....i dont care |
|
|
|
Guest9504
( )
|
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 13:33:58
|
quote:
Originally posted by freddyboy
quote:
Originally posted by Guest9504
Well since you said ENOUGH SAID.
The whole reason they get paid this much is that they are in a risky business and they will not be able to make big money for a long period of time. Take ti while you can get it.
Now we hold their hands and tell them that they can just take thier time because there is apossibility that they could get hurt again. No kidding! They play a contact sport they could get hurt. And they play it for wages we can only dream of. It is wrong. We are so damn politically corret these days because we all drink the same kool aid. and people are afraid to speak up out of fear or reprisal. I work my ass off everyday whether I am sick, tired or injured, just to make ends meet. And these primadonnas get a hang nail and sit on the sidelines. Granted a concussion is a serious injury and a player should be given adequate time to recover the same as any other injury, but he's had it. If he can practice regularly then he can play 10 to 20 minutes in one game to give their team a shot. Maurice Richard is rolling over in his grave right now.
a bit off topic but what about some baseball players, they are paid 25 millions a year and tell me it's a contact sports? they could get hurt? they have huge wages also so your point is only half working.....
joe is a god, if u dont agree....i dont care
I'm not sure I follow you Freddyboy. Can you elaborate? |
|
|
|
fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 15:19:22
|
Fair enough. I came across as personal, and I am in your estimation, guilty of that frequently. I will apologize and stick to statements rather than inferences, point taken. I will retract what I probably should not have posted in my original reply to clarify.
If I read your post correctly then, your statement is, that because they are highly paid athletes, paid ultimately by our dollars, that they then have an obligation at times to knowingly place themselves in a situation that could be life altering?, because they owe.... what?
I realize that any athlete, and indeed any of us are always in a constant opportunity of mishap, hit by a bus, etc. and that is not the point I am referring to, I am only speaking to this one situation, where, to possibly win a playoff series, in a game, for really, nothing more than our entertainment, a young man, should take an unnecessary risk, against apparently what is the judgment of everyone around him?
I don't understand the thought process behind that, and if you were offended I called it ignorance, I will apologize for offending you and can only reiterate what I added to my earlier post, that I am not attacking you, just what I feel is an ignorant statement, you are suggesting be considered a valid opinion.
My reference to the minor hockey player was no less far fetched in comparison, in the overall scope of our discussion, the only difference being the dollars and stature involved. Is that really how we judge each others worth morally? |
|
|
|
fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 15:29:25
|
quote:
Originally posted by Guest9504
quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
[quote]
Hockey is what it is, and like other contact sports, you sometimes get injured. And you don't come back and play until you're healthy. And if you don't get healthy, you stop playing altogether. There is no implied rule in hockey that dictates you play through any injury you get.
Well you're supporting my point that players are in it for themselves and not their team/city/country etc. They play when they want to and under their own terms unlike the rest of the world. and we call them heros. And you said it yourself we pay them because we want to be entertained. If we paid them 100 grand a year I could understand because they need to ensure that they can make money to survive for the next 50 years. But when you make 80x that in one season then I think you have an obligation to us fans to get out there and entertain. He's not going to die if he gets another concussion. So you get some headaches and forget your car keys from time to time, I have friends who could barely afford to feed their daughters enough nutrition through their formative years and who knows the long term damage that has caused them.
Again, I'm not saying he shouldn't be given time after a concussion to heal. I'm just saying that if he can practice for weeks he can play a few minutes. No one seems willing to address this. Obviously the management of the team didn't ahve any faith that their team could come close to winning.
Since we are hopefully back to pleasantries(highly unlikely, I know), I will try and address this post with a simple question.
You're kidding right? |
|
|
|
Guest9504
( )
|
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 15:42:20
|
quote:
Originally posted by fat_elvis_rocked
My reference to the minor hockey player was no less far fetched in comparison, in the overall scope of our discussion, the only difference being the dollars and stature involved. Is that really how we judge each others worth morally?
You can't be serious in using this. There is no comparison. I am clearly discussing adults playing at a professional level being paid millions upon millions of dollars. You only brought that up in an attempt to villify me. Now you're trying to justify it. It is a thin veil mr. fat elvis. And a broad sweeping statement about morals sounds impressive but I'm not sure how it fits.
Sydney Crosby has made a choice to be a professional athlete. There are risks involved in the sport and these athletes accept these risks and in return he gets paid beyond his wildest dreams. A generation ago people understood this privilege and realized that they owed their fans and teammates nothing but 100% committment. Nowadays this is lost. As high paid superstar athletes they can get away with this attitude, but as regular folk we are not granted this privilege. Fair enough, I don't want it, but I want those people that were given this privilege to realize in fact what it is! They don't and each time we let them get away with it they take even more. And the more they taek the more we get used to them taking it and so on. It's like they keep ripping us off and we keep saying thank you.
|
|
|
|
fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 16:02:34
|
No I am not trying to vilify you, only asking that you consider what you are stating.
You are saying that because they are highly paid athletes they have an obligation to attempt to perform, against the wishes of those around them, at risk to their long-term health, for our ENTERTAINMENT, because, since they make those big dollars, which seems to be unfair in your statements, with which I do not disagree, and that because of this, they owe it to the fans who contribute to those salaries?
If that is truly your point then any comparison I could drum up, would pale beside your point.
You have a post where you state;
"Again, I'm not saying he shouldn't be given time after a concussion to heal. I'm just saying that if he can practice for weeks he can play a few minutes. No one seems willing to address this. Obviously the management of the team didn't ahve any faith that their team could come close to winning.'
Is this any less ridiculous than my comparison, if you are stating that practicing is no less dangerous than a game 7 Stanley Cup playoff game?
You sound like a reasonable, intelligent, obviously literate, hockey fan, I wish a 'long timer' as you mentioned, such as yourself would create an account, it's much better debating a familiar face, rather than an unfamiliar guest account.
I will concede to a hockey fan's frustration, but am still unsure whether you are being serious or not. You added another post where I asked whether you were kidding or not, and I would like to see a response to that, to see if this is the case. |
|
|
|
nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 16:24:24
|
| Guest, your argument simply doesn't hold water. You're saying that the more a person gets paid, the less they should care about their own personal safety in order to do a job. I don't agree, nor does my rebuttal illustrate your point. There are many examples of people that get paid a lot of money for what they do, compared to other industries or sectors. Should the CEO of RBC work through the flu or something more serious simply because they make more money? Should the stockbroker? How about your MP, who is paid by you via tax dollars - should Jack Layton not have taken any time off when he had cancer a couple of years ago? No, none of them should have to work that way, and we should not expect them to. |
|
|
|
Guest9851
( )
|
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 18:14:04
|
quote:
Originally posted by Guest9504
As high paid superstar athletes they can get away with this attitude, but as regular folk we are not granted this privilege.
Maybe you should look at your legal rights for regular folk's job. For us regular folks (military and emergency type occupation and some others are not regular occupation and do not count), you are allowed to refuse work and still be paid for it, if it is a danger to your health. Any employer that says you must do dangerous work while you are not trained or medically capable can be charged for criminal negligence should you get hurt . Just so you understand, practice is not actually performing work.
quote:
Fair enough, I don't want it, but I want those people that were given this privilege to realize in fact what it is! They don't and each time we let them get away with it they take even more. And the more they taek the more we get used to them taking it and so on. It's like they keep ripping us off and we keep saying thank you.
What would rip me off more is that someone would trade one game for an entire career. I'd rather Crosby take 5 years off and play the next 10, rather than playing one game and never playing again. It is such a short term gain to have such a great player never to play again than to take the necessary time to heal and come back.
I pose this hypothecial choice to you:
1. Be given $10M if you are willing to have your brain completely fried via electrodes inserted in your head. After the switch is turned on you can no longer function normally in any way shape or form and require assistance at all times from family members to sustain you. ie. Crosby plays now and gets hurt to never play again.
or
2. Everyday a lab grown mosquito (it is sterilized and contains no disease) lands on you and bites you. You get 1 cent to start on the first day and each time you come you make twice as much as the last time for the rest of your life. Ie. Crosby takes his time to come back and plays out the rest of his career healthy.
Which would you pick? |
|
|
|
Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 18:30:44
|
quote:
Originally posted by Guest9504
Well since you said ENOUGH SAID.
The whole reason they get paid this much is that they are in a risky business and they will not be able to make big money for a long period of time. Take ti while you can get it.
Now we hold their hands and tell them that they can just take thier time because there is apossibility that they could get hurt again. No kidding! They play a contact sport they could get hurt. And they play it for wages we can only dream of. It is wrong. We are so damn politically corret these days because we all drink the same kool aid. and people are afraid to speak up out of fear or reprisal. I work my ass off everyday whether I am sick, tired or injured, just to make ends meet. And these primadonnas get a hang nail and sit on the sidelines. Granted a concussion is a serious injury and a player should be given adequate time to recover the same as any other injury, but he's had it. If he can practice regularly then he can play 10 to 20 minutes in one game to give their team a shot. Maurice Richard is rolling over in his grave right now.
the whole reason they get paid that much is supply and demand we pay huge ticket prices to see games and buy tonns of merch.. that is why they are paid so much,, Christian bale doesn't make millions because being a movie star is risky he makes millions because people see his name on a movie cast list and say that must be a good movie so i'm gonna go see it, it is the exact same thing for hockey players,, this is a proffessional sport not some underground fight club
"I led the league in "Go get 'em next time." - Bob Uecker
|
|
|
|
Guest6135
( )
|
Posted - 04/28/2011 : 19:11:22
|
| 9504. I understand your argument but you are looking at this only in the short term. Why would pittsburgh jeopardize the 15 + more seasons they could get out of Crosby over this year? These are not the last Stanley cup playoffs that will be played ( I hope). As a penguins fan I would rather see cups down the line and fifteen more years of great hockey from crosby than a cup this year. Anyways, Its too late now. I feel like the right decision was made. He is the current face of the game. He owes to the fans to wait until he's ready to come back. |
|
|
|
Guest8363
( )
|
Posted - 04/29/2011 : 06:05:08
|
| I agree with that...the team needed him but I guess the insurance pays too well..,..c'mon Sid, you're the greatest of the NOW! Lets go play some hockey! |
|
|
|
Guest4983
( )
|
Posted - 04/29/2011 : 06:09:12
|
the pens would have won the series if crosby was in the game he has to SUCK IT UP RIGHT NOW and i could have got his auto graph but he was not playing at the game 87  ihate him now |
|
|
|
Guest4983
( )
|
Posted - 04/29/2011 : 06:15:16
|
(Moderator Edit) Crosby has to suck it hes gonna get off the roster well who cares about crosby i always liked TEEMU SELANNE    lets go ducks next season ya lets go ducks next season i hope ducks win cup yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa i hope it happens agian one day like nexxxxxxxxxxxxxttttt season |
|
|
|
Guest4983
( )
|
Posted - 04/29/2011 : 06:17:39
|
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4983
crosby has to suck it hes gonna get off the roster well who cares about crosby i always liked TEEMU SELANNE lets go ducks next season ya lets go ducks next season i hope ducks win cup yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa i hope it happens agian one day like nexxxxxxxxxxxxxttttt season
plus i hate kunits |
|
|
|
fat_elvis_rocked
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
902 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2011 : 08:22:08
|
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4983
quote:
Originally posted by Guest4983
crosby has to suck it hes gonna get off the roster well who cares about crosby i always liked TEEMU SELANNE lets go ducks next season ya lets go ducks next season i hope ducks win cup yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa i hope it happens agian one day like nexxxxxxxxxxxxxttttt season
plus i hate kunits
....and spelling |
|
|
|
Mario 66
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
360 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2011 : 10:13:46
|
.... lets not forget logic.
In youth we learn; in age we understand |
|
|
|
just1n
PickupHockey Pro
282 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2011 : 11:51:38
|
Crosby is young and a great player, so I think they are being extra careful with him. Marc Savard is an example of a player coming back from a severe concussion, not sure if it was too soon or not, but after another one he's pretty much done. I think they are thinking long term here.
In the long run, I think the Penguins might be a better team after doing fairly well without two big guns, Crosby and Malkin. They're going to be damn good once those guys are back next year. |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
Calling Sidney Crosby 
