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 Phaneuf & Jokinen for Kovalchuk? Allow Anonymous Users Reply to This Topic...
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leigh
Moderator



Canada
1636 Posts

Posted - 01/20/2010 :  12:06:33  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
This is not a rumour I've heard but I'm wondering what you guys thing of think. Yes, I'm a Flames fan who is dreaming a little I suppose...

Flames trade Dion Phaneuf and Oli Jokinen straight up for Ilya Kovalchuk. Phaneuf's value is down right now but it should go up as I think most believe this is just a temporary lull. Kovalchuk is a left winger and Jokinen is a centerman so this might be a stumbling block...

Is it a fair deal? Do the Thrashers have cap room for these two? Could it happen? Thoughts?

Matt_Roberts85
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
936 Posts

Posted - 01/20/2010 :  12:14:36  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
not sure about the trade, i still have doubts calgary would want to shell out the dollars the Ilya wants. I heard that Kovalchuck has turned down a 12 year $100 million contract, not sure if its accurate or not but what team would pay him that? As good as he is I dont think he is worth that.

As the top player in atlanta they have made the playoffs 1 time and got swept, he may score alot but he isnt the type of player to carry a team on his back and his contract would really handcuff a teams salary cap.

Honestly, If im calagary I would hang on to Phaneuf and try your luck with Ilya on July 1st. Jokinen will probably sign somewhere else and Calgary will have the opportunity to find a new #1 centre

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E".
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8186 Posts

Posted - 01/20/2010 :  12:18:09  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Personally, I think Jokinen is still a legitimate #1 line centre in the NHL and Phaneuf is a bonified #1-#2 defensemen who is only 24ish years old. That is a huge piece of any organization and to give that up for one player, I think the price is a little high. However, when that one player is one of the 3 top snipers in the NHL, the store might be a little different. Further to that, Jokinen is a UFA at the end of the year, so it is basically a Kovalchuk for Phaneuf deal with the outside chance of keeping Jokinen for less than the $5.5 million a season he is at today. As far as cap hit, Jokinen is $5.25 and Phaneuf is $6.5 which is significantly higher than the $7.5 that Kovalchuk hits today. But short term, ATL would only get hit with the 1/4 of Jokinen's salary for the rest of the year meaning the numbers should work.

However, from a purely on ice perspective, why go after a top 3 sniper when you already have a top 5 sniper without a set up guy?? I just don't think it makes sense.

I don't really like the deal, but I would far prefer to watch Kovalchuk in Calgary 25+ nights a year they are on TV for me over Phaneuf.
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willus3
Moderator



Canada
1948 Posts

Posted - 01/20/2010 :  16:49:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Absolutely not.
Kovalchuk is without a doubt the worst floater in the league. He simply would not fit in with Sutter's system.
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Thrasher
Rookie



Canada
155 Posts

Posted - 01/20/2010 :  19:39:09  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Calgary is 25th in goals per game in the NHL. They win because of their depth in defense. Losing one to gain some one like Kovalchuk? No Brainer in my opinion. Jokinen is over rated at best. They tried him last year, didnt solve any problems. Kovalchuk is one of the most explosive dynamic players in the NHL.

Matt, sorry. Name one player, who carried a team through an entire season, and through the playoffs. What do you expect of this guy? Ovechkin hasn't done it. Crosby hasn't done it. Kovalchuk has literally been on an island almost his entire career. He had Hossa for a while, Heatley for less than a season, but both are goal scorers. He had Savard, but that was before he is the star he is now. Kovalchuk alone could push that team into the elite.

He may not be the most responsible player in his own end, but his offensive upside is well worth the gamble. I cant see this hurting Calgary more than it would help.

I Promise I didn't give her the STD, I'm not a sharing person.
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Matt_Roberts85
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
936 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  06:53:48  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thrasher, by carry on his back I didnt mean for every game all season long, I just meant really propel his team to important victories which he hasnt really done all the often. Jarome Iginla, OV, Crosby and Getzlaf have all had monster games in the post season where they pretty well won the games for their teams, Kovalchuck has never even been a part of a victory in the playoffs yet he wants to be the highest paid player in the league.

Heatley was there longer than a season, Savard had 90 points with Kovalchuck, why do you think he got a big contract from boston? Hossa played really well in Atlanta for a couple years as well. I dont mean to rag so hard on your teams best player, because he is obviously an elite talent, but I dont think 12 + years and $100 + million is worth it for him.

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E".
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Thrasher
Rookie



Canada
155 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  07:12:01  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Matt_Roberts85

Thrasher, by carry on his back I didnt mean for every game all season long, I just meant really propel his team to important victories which he hasnt really done all the often. Jarome Iginla, OV, Crosby and Getzlaf have all had monster games in the post season where they pretty well won the games for their teams, Kovalchuck has never even been a part of a victory in the playoffs yet he wants to be the highest paid player in the league.

Heatley was there longer than a season, Savard had 90 points with Kovalchuck, why do you think he got a big contract from boston? Hossa played really well in Atlanta for a couple years as well. I dont mean to rag so hard on your teams best player, because he is obviously an elite talent, but I dont think 12 + years and $100 + million is worth it for him.

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E".



Alright, that may be true. He has never propelled his team to that "next level." But when comparing Getzlaf, OV, Iggy, and Crosby, also look at the supporting cast. Yes they step up, but the players around them allow that to happen. You can't argue that each and every one of these players have a far better team than the Thrashers.

Your right, I meant to switch those two around. Hossa was there for one and a half seasons, Heatley played for I think two seasons and about thirty games in a third because of the lockout and the fact he killed someone. Savard wasn't ever considered an elite player until he moved to Boston. He had solid seasons with Atlanta yes, but until he moved away from the black hole that is Atlanta, he wasn't recognized for the player he is.

And if you look back at my post, I said nothing about salary. I'm going at this like they are looking for a rental. They probably aren't, but what i'm saying is that he alone could take that team to compete with Chicago, San Jose, and other elite teams around the league. What he's worth, is something hard to judge. There is no defining line for what a player should make, except to look at other players. If Jason Blake is making 4 mill, then Kovy should be at least 25 mill (sorry couldnt resist).

I Promise I didn't give her the STD, I'm not a sharing person.
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slozo
Moderator



Canada
4603 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  07:58:53  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Interesting potential trade . . .

On Calgary's side, we have two stars underperforming . . . or in Jokinen's case, maybe just not a good fit for whatever reason? At any rate, to get Kovalchuk back for those guys makes Calgary a team with two top-notch stars and loads them up for more scoring.

For Atlanta, you get a first line centre and a top defenceman in one swoop, and the whole team is instantly transformed - now you have two solid lines instead of just one (Antropov can play on the second line where he belongs) and you have an offensive threat from the blueline plus a guy who will keep opposition heads up at all times he's on the ice. And, most importantly . . . the franchise doesn't feel like it's folding if they get these two.

But - and I think this is crucial - would Jokinen and Phaneuf WANT to go to Atlanta? Does Phaneuf want to go to a hockey backwater after spending his career in Calgary? Does Jokinen, who finally got out of Florida, want to go back to another dud hockey city where he is expected to be the man? I highly doubt it.

And Kovalchuk a floater? Get real . . . think about it this way, Willus: as the only offensive threat for most of his time in Atlanta, Kovalchuk has always drawn the best defensive assignment and gotten the most attention. If he is a floater, how come he so consistently scores over 40 goals and 40 assists? I mean, if there is a guarantee among top point getters, it is Kovalchuk getting over 40 goals and more than 30 assists . . . and those are the "off" years.

Look at the true floaters of the game . . . there is little consistency to their game, and they usually only produce well when a team has lots of offensive options or they have excellent linemates (see: Alex Kovalev)

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
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Matt_Roberts85
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
936 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  08:00:19  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I hear ya thrasher, i wasnt looking at it as just a rental, most likley a team that trades for him would be expecting to resign him id imagine, which is why I was looking at the kind of contract he would want.

He would definatley help out a club heading into the playoffs, but thats just the short term.

Jason Blake should not be making 4 mil....thanks jfj. I get to watch him for 2 more years after this one as well! Yay LEafs!

What kind of deal would you think Kovalchuck will end up getting?

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E".
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Thrasher
Rookie



Canada
155 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  11:12:04  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Matt_Roberts85

I hear ya thrasher, i wasnt looking at it as just a rental, most likley a team that trades for him would be expecting to resign him id imagine, which is why I was looking at the kind of contract he would want.

He would definatley help out a club heading into the playoffs, but thats just the short term.

Jason Blake should not be making 4 mil....thanks jfj. I get to watch him for 2 more years after this one as well! Yay LEafs!

What kind of deal would you think Kovalchuck will end up getting?

There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E".



Ya, have with fun watching number 55 rip it up haha.

What kind of deal? Wow umm... its all dependant on whether or not he stays or goes. In Atl, i could very well see him getting that huge 12 year $100 mil, because without him they are no better than an AHL team. If he gets signed by another team, thats a tough one. From what I know he wants long term. Ecklund says hes going to Toronto (He said it so i know it won't happen). But if he did, he could probably get that as well. On a contender will limited cap space, he probably won't fit very well. I'd say a minimum of $8 mil a year is what he'll want. So unfortunately for me, he's probably staying a Thrasher.

Its a sad day....




I Promise I didn't give her the STD, I'm not a sharing person.
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JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1905 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  11:18:10  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
If the Flames seriously wanted to do this it would be great for both teams. Kovalchuk, as good as he is, needs a team to showcase him. He is currently showcasing a so/so team at the moment which has had financial difficulties. Getting Phanuef and Jokinen wouldn't make the fan base exit in droves. The question is will or would the Suttors adopt to the way Kovalchuks style of play is. I know Brent knows how to work with defensive minded grinder's, but does he know how to handle a offensive dynomo like Kovalchuk. Jokinen plays effectively when he plays like Kovalchuk does in Atlanta. Seeing Jokinen struggle in Calgary makes me think Kovalchuk will probably see a similar reduction in production.

Edited by - JOSHUACANADA on 01/21/2010 11:19:13
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Guest5905
( )

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  11:34:57  Reply with Quote
if this happened and calgary still goes out in the first round and if kovalchuk doesnt resign with calgary, the flames would just give away phaneuf and jokinen. kovalchuk will probably be traded for 2 firsts and a 2nd or players equivellent to that
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baumer
Top Prospect



82 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  11:47:44  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Never going to happen. If Atlanta's ownership group won't give Kovalchuk $0 mil a year then why would they give a combined $12 mil to Phaneuf and Jokinen. This deal will have nothing to do with talent being shipped back to Atlanta, wher he is going to end up is the team that is willing to give up picks and prospects. My bet is Boston because of the amount of first rounders they have. Los Angeles is a close second but they have some serious cap issues.
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JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1905 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  13:29:19  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Baumer, I agree, why would you want Phanuef and Jokinen if you can sign Kovalchuk, but this is a hypothetical question. I think both Jokinen and Phanuef would be equitable trade for Kovalchuk and 12 million a year is not overpaying thse 2 players. I would even venture a guess they would thrive under the offensive style of play which is a Atlanta trademark.

Guest 5905, I think Calgary has an excellent track record of signing high profile players RFA or UFA because Calgary is seen as a contender in the western conference. Albeit they are on one horrible slide right now.
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willus3
Moderator



Canada
1948 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  17:02:40  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by slozo

Interesting potential trade . . .


And Kovalchuk a floater? Get real . . . think about it this way, Willus: as the only offensive threat for most of his time in Atlanta, Kovalchuk has always drawn the best defensive assignment and gotten the most attention. If he is a floater, how come he so consistently scores over 40 goals and 40 assists? I mean, if there is a guarantee among top point getters, it is Kovalchuk getting over 40 goals and more than 30 assists . . . and those are the "off" years.

Look at the true floaters of the game . . . there is little consistency to their game, and they usually only produce well when a team has lots of offensive options or they have excellent linemates (see: Alex Kovalev)

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug


Let me re-phrase to be clear. He is the least defensively responsible player in the league.
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8186 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  20:14:23  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by willus3

quote:
Originally posted by slozo

Interesting potential trade . . .


And Kovalchuk a floater? Get real . . . think about it this way, Willus: as the only offensive threat for most of his time in Atlanta, Kovalchuk has always drawn the best defensive assignment and gotten the most attention. If he is a floater, how come he so consistently scores over 40 goals and 40 assists? I mean, if there is a guarantee among top point getters, it is Kovalchuk getting over 40 goals and more than 30 assists . . . and those are the "off" years.

Look at the true floaters of the game . . . there is little consistency to their game, and they usually only produce well when a team has lots of offensive options or they have excellent linemates (see: Alex Kovalev)

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug


Let me re-phrase to be clear. He is the least defensively responsible player in the league.



Hey Willus, I would like to see that stat machine on this one. I honestly don't watch many ATL games at all so I am not making judgement. However, I find it hard to believe there is a player that is less responsible defensively than RIck Nash.
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Guest4052
( )

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  22:03:53  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15

quote:
Originally posted by willus3

quote:
Originally posted by slozo

Interesting potential trade . . .


And Kovalchuk a floater? Get real . . . think about it this way, Willus: as the only offensive threat for most of his time in Atlanta, Kovalchuk has always drawn the best defensive assignment and gotten the most attention. If he is a floater, how come he so consistently scores over 40 goals and 40 assists? I mean, if there is a guarantee among top point getters, it is Kovalchuk getting over 40 goals and more than 30 assists . . . and those are the "off" years.

Look at the true floaters of the game . . . there is little consistency to their game, and they usually only produce well when a team has lots of offensive options or they have excellent linemates (see: Alex Kovalev)

"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug


Let me re-phrase to be clear. He is the least defensively responsible player in the league.



Hey Willus, I would like to see that stat machine on this one. I honestly don't watch many ATL games at all so I am not making judgement. However, I find it hard to believe there is a player that is less responsible defensively than RIck Nash.



Nash = -12
Kovalchuk = +2

NHL.com
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blade
Rookie



Canada
197 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2010 :  23:58:57  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Tonight I heard Bob MacKenzie on TSN talking about Calgary as a potential new home for Kovalchuk. He was speaking of Phaneuf as a part of the theoretical deal. I think that no doubt Jokinen is expendable. I wonder if this trade might actually have some legs?

The Flames need some goal scoring. Considering that Calgary on paper has one of the best defensive cores in the league I don't think it would matter too much if Kovi was weak defensively.
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JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1905 Posts

Posted - 01/22/2010 :  08:30:28  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by blade

Tonight I heard Bob MacKenzie on TSN talking about Calgary as a potential new home for Kovalchuk. He was speaking of Phaneuf as a part of the theoretical deal. I think that no doubt Jokinen is expendable. I wonder if this trade might actually have some legs?

The Flames need some goal scoring. Considering that Calgary on paper has one of the best defensive cores in the league I don't think it would matter too much if Kovi was weak defensively.

Gotta agree with this statement. I understand that players have to play under the teams system and players are encouraged to be well rounded players, but in this case you pair him with good 2way players who can pass. His lack of defensive skills, if he has any, will be made up by team play and his bonified threat to score every shift. If anything he will open up room for Jerome and company.
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Guest8605
( )

Posted - 01/22/2010 :  09:42:02  Reply with Quote
If Calgary get Kovi they will have 2 great scoring wingers and nobody to pass them the puck. They should trade phaneuf because he's overated and they could get alot for him but they should try for a centre.
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Axey
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
877 Posts

Posted - 01/23/2010 :  11:20:53  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Not a chance. That is all that has to be said. Atlanta would never do it, unless Don Waddell is a moron. Atlanta has a solid D core coming up, Kovalchuk has so much more offensive upside the Jokinen its ridiculous. Also, exactly what has been said before; two snipers, no center.
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JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1905 Posts

Posted - 01/23/2010 :  12:18:41  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Axey

Not a chance. That is all that has to be said. Atlanta would never do it, unless Don Waddell is a moron. Atlanta has a solid D core coming up, Kovalchuk has so much more offensive upside the Jokinen its ridiculous. Also, exactly what has been said before; two snipers, no center.

Would it surprise you to know that in 2 seasons Jokinen had more points that Kovalchuk on a defensive minded team 2002-03 and 2006-07. I know everyone figures Kovalchuk for one of the top goal scoring players and he is, but looking as far as 2002 to 2009 Kovalchuk had 470 points in 464 games to Jokinens 437 points in 494 games. Jokinen is better than his current stats and with his playing style doesnt belong in Calgary. Kovalchuk will fair no better or marginally better. Phanuef as a throw in would be excessive.
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Guest4274
( )

Posted - 01/24/2010 :  15:32:43  Reply with Quote
Phaneuf is the most over rated player in the entire league. If Calgary was smart they would ditch him now before everyone realizes what a piece he is. Especially now that they have J Bo.
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Axey
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
877 Posts

Posted - 01/24/2010 :  23:42:18  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA

quote:
Originally posted by Axey

Not a chance. That is all that has to be said. Atlanta would never do it, unless Don Waddell is a moron. Atlanta has a solid D core coming up, Kovalchuk has so much more offensive upside the Jokinen its ridiculous. Also, exactly what has been said before; two snipers, no center.

Would it surprise you to know that in 2 seasons Jokinen had more points that Kovalchuk on a defensive minded team 2002-03 and 2006-07. I know everyone figures Kovalchuk for one of the top goal scoring players and he is, but looking as far as 2002 to 2009 Kovalchuk had 470 points in 464 games to Jokinens 437 points in 494 games. Jokinen is better than his current stats and with his playing style doesnt belong in Calgary. Kovalchuk will fair no better or marginally better. Phanuef as a throw in would be excessive.



Excessive? I cannot agree here. Jokinen is not the player he was, he is degressing and Kovalchuk is doing the opposite, he just keeps getting better.
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JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1905 Posts

Posted - 01/25/2010 :  08:28:02  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Axey

quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA

quote:
Originally posted by Axey

Not a chance. That is all that has to be said. Atlanta would never do it, unless Don Waddell is a moron. Atlanta has a solid D core coming up, Kovalchuk has so much more offensive upside the Jokinen its ridiculous. Also, exactly what has been said before; two snipers, no center.

Would it surprise you to know that in 2 seasons Jokinen had more points that Kovalchuk on a defensive minded team 2002-03 and 2006-07. I know everyone figures Kovalchuk for one of the top goal scoring players and he is, but looking as far as 2002 to 2009 Kovalchuk had 470 points in 464 games to Jokinens 437 points in 494 games. Jokinen is better than his current stats and with his playing style doesnt belong in Calgary. Kovalchuk will fair no better or marginally better. Phanuef as a throw in would be excessive.



Excessive? I cannot agree here. Jokinen is not the player he was, he is degressing and Kovalchuk is doing the opposite, he just keeps getting better.

My point is while both Jokinen and Phanuef, may on paper, now seem to be equal to Kovalchuk, either would be considered 3/4 value for Kovalchuk if on the open market. Put it to you this way if Kovalchuk, Phanuef and Jokinen were all free agents at the end of this year, on the 1st day of free agency all 3 would be gone. Phanuef would likely command $7-8 and Jokinen would likely command $7-8, while Kovalchuk might command $10-11. I still think both are excessive for one player even if its Kovalchuk.
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Guest9836
( )

Posted - 01/25/2010 :  09:10:28  Reply with Quote
Jokinen would fetch no more than 5.5 per year on the open market. He was a workhorse in Florida, but has done little ever since.
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JOSHUACANADA
PickupHockey Veteran



Canada
1905 Posts

Posted - 01/25/2010 :  09:24:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest9836

Jokinen would fetch no more than 5.5 per year on the open market. He was a workhorse in Florida, but has done little ever since.

I bet you the Rangers, Philly, Edmonton or Montreal would sign him for at least $7,000,000.00 Think about it, who would you rather have Gomez, Horcoff, Drury, Briere or Jokinen? At least Jokinen has the size and durability to play a whole season, even if he gets similar point per game stats.

Edited by - JOSHUACANADA on 01/25/2010 09:25:24
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Beans15
Moderator



Canada
8186 Posts

Posted - 01/25/2010 :  09:26:48  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA

quote:
Originally posted by Axey

quote:
Originally posted by JOSHUACANADA

quote:
Originally posted by Axey

Not a chance. That is all that has to be said. Atlanta would never do it, unless Don Waddell is a moron. Atlanta has a solid D core coming up, Kovalchuk has so much more offensive upside the Jokinen its ridiculous. Also, exactly what has been said before; two snipers, no center.

Would it surprise you to know that in 2 seasons Jokinen had more points that Kovalchuk on a defensive minded team 2002-03 and 2006-07. I know everyone figures Kovalchuk for one of the top goal scoring players and he is, but looking as far as 2002 to 2009 Kovalchuk had 470 points in 464 games to Jokinens 437 points in 494 games. Jokinen is better than his current stats and with his playing style doesnt belong in Calgary. Kovalchuk will fair no better or marginally better. Phanuef as a throw in would be excessive.



Excessive? I cannot agree here. Jokinen is not the player he was, he is degressing and Kovalchuk is doing the opposite, he just keeps getting better.

My point is while both Jokinen and Phanuef, may on paper, now seem to be equal to Kovalchuk, either would be considered 3/4 value for Kovalchuk if on the open market. Put it to you this way if Kovalchuk, Phanuef and Jokinen were all free agents at the end of this year, on the 1st day of free agency all 3 would be gone. Phanuef would likely command $7-8 and Jokinen would likely command $7-8, while Kovalchuk might command $10-11. I still think both are excessive for one player even if its Kovalchuk.




First of all, your salaries are wack. Jokinen will be luck to get $5 million on the open market. He's not the same player he once was and no one is going to pay $7 million let alone $8 million for less than a PPG player. He has gone from a 90 point players in 06, to 71 point, 57 point, and this year is on pace for 51 points. Further more, he has not been a plus player for the past 4 seasons. $7-$8 million would make him one of the 10 highest paid forwards in the league. He would NEVER get that money on the open market.


Phaneuf, for $7-8 million??? There are only 7 players with a 09/10 salary of $7 million of more and let's face it, Phaneuf has slide the past 2 years. If he was still scoring 20 goals and 50-60 points then I might agree. But he is not. The NHL is a 'what have you done for me lately' league and Phaneuf in the past 2 years does not warrant being one of the highest paid defensemen in the NHL.

Now Kovalchuk, one of the games premeir goal scorers and point getters, will absolutely get $10 million a season. I think his wish for $11 million is greedy, but he is one of only 2 or 3 guys in the world today that can do what he does as well.

And the most important piece is that this is not a fair market trade and has to be assessed as such. Phaneuf is the only player of the 3 that is under contract long term. Both Kovalchuk and Jokinen are UFA's at the end of the year. Realistically, this deal should be looked at as Phaneuf for Kovalchuk and Jokinen is basically the official rights for Calgary to negotiate with Kovalchuk.
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Guest2789
( )

Posted - 01/25/2010 :  10:40:19  Reply with Quote
Jokinen is a joke....I can't believe Calgary would choose to keep Jokey over Camalleri....Dummies!! Calgary deserves to be where they are in the standings. Jokinen is an underacheiver. If they can pull the trigger on this deal..it should be done in a new york minute. How about Souray, Cogliano and Gilbert for Kovi?
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Axey
PickupHockey Pro



Canada
877 Posts

Posted - 01/25/2010 :  10:52:06  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Guest2789

Jokinen is a joke....I can't believe Calgary would choose to keep Jokey over Camalleri....Dummies!! Calgary deserves to be where they are in the standings. Jokinen is an underacheiver. If they can pull the trigger on this deal..it should be done in a new york minute. How about Souray, Cogliano and Gilbert for Kovi?



We're close with this deal but once again you have to look at it like this. A proven sniper and top 5 player in the league for an aging injury prone offensive D man in which Atlanta has plenty of, a young forward with potential but has proven nothing yet, and a young Dman also offensive who had a good year last year offensively but still had a huge amount of giveaways and not so well this year.

A Kovalchuk trade is going to involve, a star forward, 2 high end prospects and a 1st rounder in my opinion. A team like LA could pull it off, or St. Louis. Edmonton could as well but the deal will have to change a bit.
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willus3
Moderator



Canada
1948 Posts

Posted - 01/25/2010 :  11:45:36  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Here's what D. Sutter has to say about the whole thing.


"He's a star player who is unrestricted next year, so you'd have to give up players under contract for a guy who isn't -- I don't think that's a move that's in the best interest of the organization," said Sutter, who told the Sun Saturday he has no plans to do anything radical such as trading Dion Phaneuf or Robyn Regehr before the deadline.

"When you have a $7-million player (Jarome Iginla), you aren't going to be able to have a $10-million player, too."

http://www.calgarysun.com/sports/col...99561-sun.html



“I don’t really care what you think, to tell you the truth,” the Calgary Flames general manager said Saturday afternoon. “I’m not sure those are (real) fans and I’m not so sure any of the media are fans, so it doesn’t really matter.”
and


“First of all, there is no urge (to move players),” said Sutter, home after a weeklong peek at the Eastern Conference. “And there’s not many trades in the NHL, if you paid attention. We’ve made two this year (sending Anton Stralman to the Columbus Blue Jackets for a third-round pick, Sept. 28; acquiring defenceman Aaron Johnson from the Chicago Blackhawks in exchange for winger Kyle Greentree, Oct. 7) and most teams haven’t made any.”

“So this is no different than any other year,” said Sutter. “A lot of it is based on payroll. Our team is middle of the league, 17th or 18th, in payroll. When you’ve got 22 teams over $50 million, it makes for less movement. Most of the teams’ work is done prior to the season now.

“That’s why I don’t put a whole lot of stock in what someone thinks in the last week or so . . . because it real­ly doesn’t have any impact on anything.”

“Rumours? Rumours? What are they?” said Sutter. “Somebody’s idea? Somebody says something? I don’t really know what rumours are. Not much gets done in this world based on rumours.”

http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/...433/story.html
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baumer
Top Prospect



82 Posts

Posted - 01/25/2010 :  13:04:33  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Report out of Los Angeles today has the Kings offering Frolov, Randy Jones and a 1st rounder this year. Frolov and a 1st rounder is understandable butI don't hink Don Waddell will take Randy Jones. I can see him asking for Johnson.
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