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sharksfan44
Rookie
Canada
228 Posts |
 Posted - 02/04/2010 : 16:54:25
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USA Today is reporting that thrashers star winger has been dealt to the New Jersey Devils. There is no news on who atlnata has gotten in return, but geez, do the devils look ever so dangerous now.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=308953
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Edited by - sharksfan44 on 02/04/2010 17:00:07
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Thrasher
Rookie
Canada
155 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 17:14:17
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First of all, love how Kovy has 328 goals but only 278 points. Proof read anyone?
WOW. Unless Jersey gave up Parise, this team may soon become a serious powerhouse. They have the greatest goaltender of all time, and now, one of the top goal scorers in the NHL. This team could make some loud noise come playoffs.
Poor Atlanta. Poor Don Waddell. I don't care what they got back, they lost this deal. They might become the new Coyotes, cause why would anyone go watch them now? Todd White? I don't think so.
I Promise I didn't give her the STD, I'm not a sharing person. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 17:21:06
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If I was a betting man, which I am, I would think Zajac, Colin White, a prospect, and 2 draft picks.
New Jersey surprises me big time but wow, they are pretty strong up front now. |
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redneck76ca
Rookie
186 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 17:23:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
If I was a betting man, which I am, I would think Zajac, Colin White, a prospect, and 2 draft picks.
New Jersey surprises me big time but wow, they are pretty strong up front now.
Johnny Oduya, Nik Bergfors, Patrice Cormier and a first round pick. This is a very reasonable trade. Lou has got a nice rental and if he can re-sign him the Devils will be scary. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 17:32:01
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quote:
Originally posted by redneck76ca
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
If I was a betting man, which I am, I would think Zajac, Colin White, a prospect, and 2 draft picks.
New Jersey surprises me big time but wow, they are pretty strong up front now.
Johnny Oduya, Nik Bergfors, Patrice Cormier and a first round pick. This is a very reasonable trade. Lou has got a nice rental and if he can re-sign him the Devils will be scary.
Good for Waddell too. I might have expected a bit more, but Oduya is a wall on the back end, Bergfors appears to developing nicely, and the 1st rounder is solid. Save $4 million a season today ang $6 million next year. |
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Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 17:34:48
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Reasonable trade for the devils but IMO the thrashers are getting ripped off, sure something is better than nothing but there team just went from being 1 point of the playoffs to almost a lottery team I think.
CANUCKS RULE!!!
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polishexpress
PickupHockey Pro
525 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 17:46:20
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| I think short term, NJ is the winner, but Atlanta wins long term, if Patrice Cormier gets past his recent issues, and the 1st rounder pays off. |
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Guest3652
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Posted - 02/04/2010 : 17:47:56
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| Tough the Devils were looking for a offensive defencemen also. If theu can get any, they'll be very hard to beat |
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sharksfan44
Rookie
Canada
228 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 17:49:18
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definitley an interesting trade. New Jersey has definitley hit the lottery with that trade. I mean, i like oduya and bergfors, but kovalchuck is a star, and i think new jersey got him for a fairly cheap price.
For atlanta, this isn't that bad of a trade either. Oduya is a solid d-man, bergfors is young and improving, dont know bout cormier, but if he can straighten himself out u never no, and a first rounder is never bad to have. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 17:49:36
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New News, It's Kovalchuk, a prospect(Anssi Salmela), and a 3rd rounder for Oduya, Bergfors, Cormier, a 1st rounder and a 2nd rounder.
Just think how much more Kovalchuk would have been worth if a deal happened 3-4 months ago??
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 18:00:13
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Damn!
Kovalchuk to New Jersey, didn't exactly expect it. I seen them as perhaps a team with some interest, but I really didn't see them getting him.
The price for Kovalchuk, IF he signs long-term was fairly cheap. If he turns out as simply a rental in the end, it was a fair price to pay when you include Salmela and 3rd regained.
Irvine/prez. |
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just1n
PickupHockey Pro
282 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 18:11:55
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Whoa! I would think that Atlanta could get more, or wait it out a bit more, but this must have been a huge distraction for the team and Waddell wanted it done and over with as they are still in the mix to make the playoffs. A couple roster players out of it.
That's gotta hurt for any Thrashers fans though, almost as bad as looking at their horrid jerseys and logo. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 18:16:53
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Dunno, if NJ can't resign him and they don't win the cup, how can this be considered a good trade for them? It could come down to this years cup and it'd be do or die! Unless, they've got some sort of extension in the works that we don't know about?
Wonder how Kovalchuk will like playing for a guy like Lemaire? He hasn't exactly held Parise back so maybe all will be well? |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 18:34:56
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Wow, just - wow. The Devils . . . . crap.
And it doesn't looklike they lost anyone of significance other than Johnny Oduya . . . what a steal for Lou.
Kovalchuk is now in the playoffs, and with a first place team who didn't need him carrying the team on his shoulders. Parise might now be the best second line LW in the NHL . . .
Kovalchuk - Zajac - Langenbrunner
Parise - Zubrus - Bergfors
Rolston - R.Niedermayer - Zharkov
How scary does New Jersey look now with another game-changer (I'd count Parise as one) in their line-up? And how much better will they be when/if Elias comes back from his concussion?
It's bad news for Washington and Pittsburgh, that's for sure.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro
735 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 18:54:54
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| Good lines Slozo except Bergfors was out of New Jersey in the deal. But I agree about Parise being on the second line. My bet is Kovalchuk will play the point on the pp. so then you have Langenbrunner, Zajac, Parise and Kovalchuk. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 19:04:26
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My bad! Bergfors was gone in the deal, yes . . . so I shouldn't just say Oduya was the only player of significance leaving.
Actually, Oduya and a young promising Bergfors, plus Cormier and the draft pick, is a high return for a rental, very high. The Devils may regret this a bit if they can't resign Kovalchuk, but the allure of a perennial playoff team like NJ would be hard to resist, even if Brodeur is in his golden years.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Thrasher17
Top Prospect
Canada
84 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 19:51:56
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Never thought i'd have to change my avatar... Oh well at least now I get to cheer for Kovy in the playoffs on a team that will play more than 4 games.
As for the lines, I can't see NJ splitting up their top line... which would put Kovy on line 2... that doesn't feel right... with Elias (when healthy) and Zubrus.
What does Atlanta do now? Close up shop and fold the team? |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 20:45:42
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You know what, as a lifelong Rangers fan, it's a given that i don't like the Devils. But, to be honest, i'm kind of happy for Devils fans today.
It's not too often they land a marquee talent either by trade or free agency. In recent years they've had to watch star player after star player leave as free agents (Niedermayer, Rafalski, Gomez, Gionta, Holik, etc.). Sure i'd take the Devils history of winning the last 15 years over the Rangers penchant for landing the big names like Lindros, Jagr, Bure, Fleury, Kovalev, Gaborik, etc...but i'm sure Devils fans will be estatic that they've added a superstar for once. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 22:31:44
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| I'm on the same page as you Thrasher17.....i don't know if they're gonna change the Zajac / Parise line? These two have played well together for quite some time now? I'm guessing they'll basically be a 1 and 1a line team and have them all together on the power play? Unless they wanna try Kovy or Parise on the RW, then they'd have a pretty sick 1st line! |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 22:37:02
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Lamorillo was on a conference call I listened to and when asked about resigning Kovalchuk, he did everything but say he wasn't interested. He basically said he is focused on bringing Kovalchuk in, getting him comfortable, and getting him playing. Outside of that, he said resigning him isn't even in his mind, yet.
I can't see how NJ can resign him without dropping at least one of their bigger forwards contracts like Elias ($6 million, getting long in the tooth and hard to move), Rolston ($5 million and similar to Elias) or Zajac(a little under $4 million). Plus, their #1 defensemen in Paul Martin is also a UFA this summer and he will be looking for a raise on his $4ish million a season.
I see Kovalchuk as a rental which means I think Lamorillo gave up a lot for that. However, if Kovalchuk signs long term in NJ, then deal is a steal for NJ.
Anyone else think about Waddell, in the past 3 season, has trade 2 of the games most dynamic players and really got no where near the value for either of them??? |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 22:42:12
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Beans, that's the prob when GM's leave these UFA's till their final year, no? If he really thought all along (until recently of course) that he could get a deal done, then i can see keeping him this long? But just how much can you command for a guy, regardless of who he is, if he's possibly just a rental?
Totally agree, if NJ doesn't plan to resign him, and that's gonna be difficult as you pointed out, then it's a big price to pay. They darn well better win the cup, it's the only way to justify what they gave up when you look back at the deal in the next few years?
I will say this about Atlanta and Waddell though, if he were willing to throw 10 mill a year at Kovy, surely he can go out and sign a couple of guys with that money? Maybe a 6 and 4 mill guy? Question is, will guys in that range wanna play in Atl? Maybe the 6 mill guy will only be a 4.5-5mill guy in reality and they'll have to overpay? |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 22:56:51
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Here is a question. When can you resign a player?? Does the team have to wait until the last year of the contract or can it be done earlier than that. I don't recall a player getting resigned earlier than their final year of a deal.
One would have to think that Ovechkin's and Richard's monster deals last year puts some bigger dollar signs in Kovalchuk's eyes. I would think that prior to those deals, a 8ish year contract for $70-$75 million would have done it. Today, it's closer to $90 million for that 8 year deal. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2010 : 23:57:29
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| Pretty sure you can resign (sign an extension) at any time? Not entirely sure of that but i thought this had been done in the past? |
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Larrydavid
Top Prospect
Canada
37 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2010 : 06:19:17
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I am pretty sure you can only sign them after July 1st starting their last year of a contract. Atlanta could have signed Kovy last July but not before.
Not surprised to see Patrice go in this trade. Lou doesn't need players like him.
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Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro
735 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2010 : 09:04:58
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Lamorillo was on a conference call I listened to and when asked about resigning Kovalchuk, he did everything but say he wasn't interested. He basically said he is focused on bringing Kovalchuk in, getting him comfortable, and getting him playing. Outside of that, he said resigning him isn't even in his mind, yet.
I can't see how NJ can resign him without dropping at least one of their bigger forwards contracts like Elias ($6 million, getting long in the tooth and hard to move), Rolston ($5 million and similar to Elias) or Zajac(a little under $4 million). Plus, their #1 defensemen in Paul Martin is also a UFA this summer and he will be looking for a raise on his $4ish million a season.
I see Kovalchuk as a rental which means I think Lamorillo gave up a lot for that. However, if Kovalchuk signs long term in NJ, then deal is a steal for NJ.
Anyone else think about Waddell, in the past 3 season, has trade 2 of the games most dynamic players and really got no where near the value for either of them???
It doesn't just depend on if they sign him back. Yes it has a lot to do with it but also how far they will go in the playoffs also has its two cents.
Like Pittsburgh even though Marian Hossa was just a rental, they still went to the Stanley Cup final, lost in game 7, made a bunch of money with all the extra games they played at home during the playoffs, and plus it gave them experience which they uuse to win the cup the next year. At that point it seemed a whole lot for a rental and they didn't resign him in the offseason, but I'm sure Pittsburgh would do it again.
And if New Jersey goes to the final or win the Cup, then the trade is worth it. But I'm aware that lots of time teams gives a lot in return for a rental and doesn't go deep in the playoffs. We will have to wait and see. |
Edited by - Leafs81 on 02/05/2010 09:07:49 |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2010 : 09:28:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Leafs81
[brBut I'm aware that lots of time teams gives a lot in return for a rental and doesn't go deep in the playoffs. We will have to wait and see.
Like these very same Thrashers a few years ago, they gave up a lot for Keith Tkachuk, and then were swept in 4 straight by the Rangers in the 1st round.
I assume Kovalchuk is going to be in the line-up tonight? Looking forward to watching the game! |
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Hugh G. Rection
Rookie
165 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2010 : 09:40:38
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I'd be shocked if Lou and Kovy haven't already discussed a longer-term deal. Lamarello isn't the kind of GM that would normally throw around prospects and first-rounders for potentially 2 months of a 50 goal scorer. Unless he feels that Brodeur's prime is soon ending, and needs to go for it now.
That being said, I can't imagine the insanity of teams throwing offers at Kovalchuk should be become unrestricted on July 1. But can any team in the league match what Waddell offered him? Not too many guys turn down 100+ million, so we'll see what happens. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2010 : 09:48:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Hugh G. Rection
I'd be shocked if Lou and Kovy haven't already discussed a longer-term deal. Lamarello isn't the kind of GM that would normally throw around prospects and first-rounders for potentially 2 months of a 50 goal scorer. Unless he feels that Brodeur's prime is soon ending, and needs to go for it now.
That being said, I can't imagine the insanity of teams throwing offers at Kovalchuk should be become unrestricted on July 1. But can any team in the league match what Waddell offered him? Not too many guys turn down 100+ million, so we'll see what happens.
Hugh, from Beans' reaction to the conference call he heard from Lamoriello, maybe ol' Lou is seeing the end of Brodeurs dominance coming? Then again, he might not be telling the truth completely either?
As for Kovy next year, i don't know if you'll see an offer higher than what Atl offered? I get the feeling they knew he wouln't sign and threw that offer out there so that they could go back to their fans and say "we tried our best, look what he turned down". That's a huge chunk of salary as far as a team's cap goes! |
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Guest4813
( )
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Posted - 02/05/2010 : 10:05:10
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| There are a lot of rumours that Kovalchuk is going to the KHL and all this because of the money he turned down. I feel that he would have turned down any deal from the Thrashers no unless the cap was lifted and they could offer him 100 mill for the season. Whats attractive about playing in Atlanta if your a hockey player, I no New Jersey doesn't exactly fill the seats but they are a team that wins, in Atlanta your playing infront of 5000 people and losing, playoffs once in 8 years, these guys are all competitive and you can bet a guy like Kovalchuk loves to win as much as Ovechkin and missing the playoffs all those years must have been killing him, sure he got a couple World Championship golds, but the one thing about that tournament is you have to fail in the NHL to play there, to me it seems like a bittersweet tournament. I expect to see Kovalchuk in the NHL next season, with a team that has a chance of doing something in the playoffs for a reasonable (for his skill level, not in the real world) contract |
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Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2010 : 10:09:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest4813
There are a lot of rumours that Kovalchuk is going to the KHL and all this because of the money he turned down. I feel that he would have turned down any deal from the Thrashers no unless the cap was lifted and they could offer him 100 mill for the season. Whats attractive about playing in Atlanta if your a hockey player, I no New Jersey doesn't exactly fill the seats but they are a team that wins, in Atlanta your playing infront of 5000 people and losing, playoffs once in 8 years, these guys are all competitive and you can bet a guy like Kovalchuk loves to win as much as Ovechkin and missing the playoffs all those years must have been killing him, sure he got a couple World Championship golds, but the one thing about that tournament is you have to fail in the NHL to play there, to me it seems like a bittersweet tournament. I expect to see Kovalchuk in the NHL next season, with a team that has a chance of doing something in the playoffs for a reasonable (for his skill level, not in the real world) contract
I wrote this, also I heard an interview with Mathieu Schnieder when he signed with the Canucks in the summer and he was saying it was tough playing in Atlanta because everyone in the dressing room new they were going to lose most of their games, it can't be very fun playing on a team with that attitude.
CANUCKS RULE!!!
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2010 : 18:43:16
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First off. there is no need to read into what Kovalchuk turned down from Atlanta and expect him to want that kind of money or more next season . . . he wanted out of Atlanta, period, and no amount of money was worth him re-signing.
As others have said, Atlanta's GM needed to make a huge last offer for the last 10 fans they have, to let them know they did their best. It's a good PR move, in fact, the only move they had left.
As I wrote about earlier in other threads, Kovalchuk is a super competitive guy, same as any of the other top stars in the league, and wants to win and play in meaningful games just like everyone else. And why shouldn't he? He can have his pick of teams basically, he is in his prime, and is a world-class player . . . you can tell by the team he chose that he wants to be in the playoffs, and there is no other guarantee like New Jersey (used to be Detroit too, but we have seen the wheels fall off a bit this year).
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2010 : 19:15:12
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Ilya Kovalchuk's New Jersey Debut.
Time on Ice: 21:43
Shifts: 21
Goals: 0
Assists: 2
PIM: 2
Plenty of ice time for Kovalchuk. Sadly, I was unable to watch the game to "Region Restrictions" and crappy internet.
However, after reviewing his stats for a "second" line winger he sure had a solid amount of ice time. Two assists in debut, not bad.
He seems to have been a difference maker. Thoughts on his game, from those who seen it?
Irvine/prez. |
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Thrasher17
Top Prospect
Canada
84 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2010 : 10:00:17
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I watched the game. He wasn't spectacular and you could tell it is going to take a little bit for Kovy to adjust to the new system. But I guess that should be expected considering hes going from one of the most offensive teams in the league (one he's played for for 8 years) to one of the most defensive.
I noticed it a lot on the PP. He seemed to avoid carrying the puck, other than one rush he made. But again, he'd been there for less than 24 hours so I'm sure he just got told to go play the point.
I'm excited to watch the game tonight vs the Rangers.
One other thing I noticed was Kovy didn't have his jersey tucked in as he always did in ATL... Do you think it was because it was his first game and wanted fans to be able to see his number? Or does NJ have a different "dress code" and not want him to tuck it in? |
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kovy to jersey? 
