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Guest0906
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 Posted - 02/10/2010 : 17:40:30
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| Yup looks like Carter would be the replacement, but if this poll shows anything more than 9 out of 10 hockey fans wouldn't make the same choice. 10 votes out of 147... hmmm.. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 19:26:17
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I heard there's some talk that they might even consider sitting Getzlaf for the first two to allow him a few more days rest / recovery? I assume that means they can't use Carter in those games or can they dress Getzlaf and use him as the extra forward? Can a team do that? Not sure of the rules for this sort of thing?
I will say, Getzlaf is a huge loss, moreso that i think some realize (if he in fact can't go). He's such a good mix of size, strength and skill in the center position, not to mention the chemistry with Perry! |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 19:36:41
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| If i'm not mistake, teams dress 20 skaters every game. 13 forwards & 7 defensemen. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 20:13:51
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What i meant, and did a terrible job of implying, was does Canada have to decide between Getzlaf and Carter at the start of the games? Let's say they go with Getzlaf and dress 12 fwds for the first two games. Then, he plays vs the US and finds he just can't go. Can they then turn to Carter?
OR, can they dress Carter and replace him with Getzlaf after a couple games once he heals more? I'm guessing a big "NO" to this scenario? |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 20:32:30
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Well, Carter isn't a bad choice . . . he is a tough, dynamic center with good speed, a serious shot, and he's also a good penalty killer.
What hasn't been mentioned, but is surely on the minds of team Canada officials, is compatibility . . . and Carter with Mike Richards on the penalty kill, and probably on the same line, is surely the plan.
If Getzlaf is out, what will be interesting is what happens to Perry?
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 20:39:45
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Slozo, that's so true. While i don't wanna take anything away from Perry cuz he's a good player on his own, he's likely on this team because of his chemistry with Getzlaf. Like i said, he's a good player (above avg) but there are others in his class who could easily take his place? I can't see them dropping him for someone else but it's not entirely impossible i guess?
Perry's a big physical winger, i think he stays. The only slight change if Getzlaf's out might be that the line Perry is on becomes the 3rd line? Most things i've read considered them the 2nd line but i'd have the SJ connection as the third line either way really? |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 22:02:45
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If anyone watched that show about the selection of the team, the picks make sense based on the objective of the selection committee and Carter fits with that objective better than B. Ricahrds or St. Louis or Stamkos. The light bulb moment came when Yzerman and the boys looks that potential lines and realized that they come hard with size, speed, and skill across the board and worried less about how to match up with the other team and thought more on making their lines harder to match up against.
Carter has that (specifically size) over the others that could be selected.
And, as Slozo said(props bro, completely agree ) that Richards/Carter PK could be a huge defining pairing that has the potential to make a medal deciding contribution.
Perry, however, still has his spot on the team. I don't believe he made the team based on his chemisty with Getzlaf alone.
6'3". 210 lbs. Speed, strength, nose for the net. He's there with or without Getzlaf but it's much sweeter when they are together. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 22:06:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Alex116
I heard there's some talk that they might even consider sitting Getzlaf for the first two to allow him a few more days rest / recovery? I assume that means they can't use Carter in those games or can they dress Getzlaf and use him as the extra forward? Can a team do that? Not sure of the rules for this sort of thing?
I will say, Getzlaf is a huge loss, moreso that i think some realize (if he in fact can't go). He's such a good mix of size, strength and skill in the center position, not to mention the chemistry with Perry!
I don't believe this is in the rules this year. No taxi sqaud. Not substitutions once the tourney starts. The roster is set and even if a player is injured during an Olympic game, no substitute can be made.
It's Carter or Getzlaf. Not both or a combination. |
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Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 23:09:20
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Sure part of Perry making the team was his chemistry with Getzlaf, but if Getzlaf can't go its not like Perry will be playing with a slouch, all the Centers are first liners (save Bergeron who made the team for other reasons) but putting him with Crosby, Thornton, Staal, Carter, Toews or Richards isn't a huge step down from Getzlaf.
CANUCKS RULE!!!
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 23:11:54
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| Beans, that's what i thought too but wasn't sure. That's a little scary in that carrying 13 only really allows you 1 injury before you have to start playing a dman on the wing??? So, as far fetched as this may be, if a team loses three guys in their first game with serious injuries, they're in a lot of trouble? And i'm not talking just because they lost 3 starters, but they'd be really shorthanded from there on out??? |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2010 : 23:49:39
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Just found this on NBCOlympics.com in an article originally dated Dec 23/09 and updated on Jan 6 of this year:
Eleven of the 12 men's Olympic hockey teams have named their Vancouver rosters. The U.S. roster will be named on Jan. 1, after the NHL's Winter Classic at Fenway Park. But the deadline to make changes is Feb. 15, the first day of play, allowing teams to make substitutes for injured players.
This time, there won't be a "taxi squad" of alternates ready to head to Vancouver -- the roster on Feb. 15 is final, regardless of injuries.
Teams can bring up to 20 skaters and three goaltenders, but only two goalies can dress for a game. Some teams will bring 13 forwards and seven defenseman, and some will bring 12 forwards and eight defenseman. Below are the preliminary round groups, with links to each team's roster.
Wow, let's hope Getlaf is honest with his injury and if he can't go at or darn near 100% that he informs Stevie Y of the truth! Hate to see him tweak it in the first game! |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/11/2010 : 05:08:25
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| Some teams didn't even bother bringing an extra forward. I believe there's at least 2 countries that went with 12 forwards & 8 defensemen. |
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Guest9836
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Posted - 02/11/2010 : 06:22:03
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quote:
Originally posted by slozo
Well, Carter isn't a bad choice . . . he is a tough, dynamic center with good speed, a serious shot, and he's also a good penalty killer.
What hasn't been mentioned, but is surely on the minds of team Canada officials, is compatibility . . . and Carter with Mike Richards on the penalty kill, and probably on the same line, is surely the plan.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
A good point, but if they wanted a solid penalty killing center then Jordan Staal would have been the man. He averages the 4th highest SH TOI per game in the league amongst forwards (3:14 /game). The next highest forward, who is on team Canada, is Marleau (2:34 / game). Richards and Carter aren't even the top 2 PK guys in Philly (Betts and Laperriere if you can believe it).
M Richards comes in at 2:11 /game, and Carter at 1:49 / game.
I guess with such a short time to come together as a team pre-built chemistry is the trump card.
One last note:
Looking at TOI/game in general Ryan Getzlaf has highest number of minutes per game amongst Can forwards followed by Crosby, St.Louis, Perry, Nash, and Marleau (all over 21 mins). |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/11/2010 : 08:33:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest9836
[quote]Originally posted by slozo Richards and Carter aren't even the top 2 PK guys in Philly (Betts and Laperriere if you can believe it).
I can believe it. Blair Betts is excellent on the PK. He was one of the best penalty killers i've ever seen play for the Rangers. I was very disappointed when they left him go in the off-season. |
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Guest9836
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Posted - 02/11/2010 : 08:43:11
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| I guess I meant more for Laperriere, I'd figure he'd be the one in the box causing those penalties. |
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Guest9124
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Posted - 02/12/2010 : 09:42:58
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| Lacavalier because his neck is wider than his head |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/12/2010 : 09:45:17
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| On the topic of Blair Betts, the Flyers signed him to a 2-year extension today. Wish the Rangers still had him... |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/12/2010 : 10:33:55
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If anyone watched the "On Home Ice" which has been shown on RSN in the past week or so it would make total sense why Carter is the next pick.
Not only was he literally the odd man out when the selection process happened but his fits the theme. Look down that roster of forwards and let me a guy that is not big and physical (or in Crosby's case at least very strong) and have a ton of offensive skill.
The Canada MO for this Olympics is clearly size, speed, and difficult to defend.
Carter fits that mold better than J. Staal, Stamkos, St. Louis, B. Richards, etc.
Now that is established, based on the players that are picked, who would be a better PK pairing than Carter and M. Richards??? Maybe Morrow and Toews, but that's about it. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/12/2010 : 21:37:47
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Yeah, size and toughness have been huge considerations alonside the prerequisite skill. Carter has really picked it up since his very slow start,
I have a feeling that team Canada has been built with the Russians and Swedes in mind, as they are both potential gold medal opponents who are at least as skilled as Canada and have many big boys to deal with.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 02/12/2010 : 21:51:54
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Carter fits that mold better than J. Staal, Stamkos, St. Louis, B. Richards, etc.
Now that is established, based on the players that are picked, who would be a better PK pairing than Carter and M. Richards??? Maybe Morrow and Toews, but that's about it.
Although I understand what you are saying. I still have a question... how does Jeff Carter fit that mold of size, skill & hard to get off the puck, over a guy like Jordan Staal?
Staal is 6'4, 220 Lbs. Plays a solid defensive game, will go in those high traffic areas, competes hard every night & kills penalties with the best of them. Not to mention, he can also play C or Wing, depending on your needs.
I'm not saying Carter is a bad choice, but I'd say personally that Staal fits that mod just as well as Carter, if not more so.
Plus, i'm sure Eric & Jordan still have some chemistry left from all those years of playing togeather in their youth. :)
Irvine/prez. |
Edited by - irvine on 02/12/2010 21:56:56 |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2010 : 10:01:56
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Irvine, J.Staal doesn't fit the mold based on offensive output. I completely agree with his size, speed, and skill. But he has been a max 30ish goal guy where Carter has been a 40+ goal guy.
I am not saying I am disagreeing with you at all, but when looking at the strategy, it makes sense. Also, if you think about a replacing a player like Getzlaf with a similar player, Carter is more similar to Getlzaf is than Staal is. |
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Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro
735 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2010 : 10:35:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
If anyone watched the "On Home Ice" which has been shown on RSN in the past week or so it would make total sense why Carter is the next pick.
Not only was he literally the odd man out when the selection process happened but his fits the theme. Look down that roster of forwards and let me a guy that is not big and physical (or in Crosby's case at least very strong) and have a ton of offensive skill.
The Canada MO for this Olympics is clearly size, speed, and difficult to defend.
Carter fits that mold better than J. Staal, Stamkos, St. Louis, B. Richards, etc.
Now that is established, based on the players that are picked, who would be a better PK pairing than Carter and M. Richards??? Maybe Morrow and Toews, but that's about it.
That's why Staal should have been in instead of Bergeron. And I agree by losing Getzlaf (if they do) well Carter is a good replacement if they wanted a big skill player who can cycle the puck very well. I'm sure Carter, Staal and Perry will do just fine. |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/13/2010 : 20:28:21
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Although we won't find out until Monday at the earliest, the media seems to think Sidney Crosby will be centering Eric Staal & Patrice Bergeron.
As far as Getzlaf, he didn't play tonight for Anaheim, i have a hard time believing he'll be able to play at the Olympics, too bad. |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/14/2010 : 18:43:40
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| Wow not only did Getzlaf play tonight, but he had 2 goals & 2 assits!! |
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Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 02/14/2010 : 20:16:42
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quote:
Originally posted by ryan93
Wow not only did Getzlaf play tonight, but he had 2 goals & 2 assits!!
Yeah! Hopefully this means he is good to go, I think 80% Getzlaf is still better than 100% Carter.
CANUCKS RULE!!!
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/14/2010 : 20:31:06
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Yep, Getzlaf looks good to go for sure. Good news for Canada, because as we all saw last playoffs, he can be one of the most dominating players on the ice on any given day.
I hate to wish injuries on anyone, but couldn't Bergeron at least tweak a groin or something?
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2010 : 00:08:45
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quote:
Originally posted by slozo
Yep, Getzlaf looks good to go for sure. Good news for Canada, because as we all saw last playoffs, he can be one of the most dominating players on the ice on any given day.
I hate to wish injuries on anyone, but couldn't Bergeron at least tweak a groin or something?
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
Slozo, when's he gonna tweak his groin, maybe walking off the plane? Lol, i know what you mean though. More surprising to me than his being named to the team would be him getting pencilled in on the top line!! Def didn't see that coming!
As for Getzlaf, great news after seeing his stats tonight! Would be tough to leave him off now i'd say? Would have been interesting to see if he played but didn't do much or maybe didn't play as much as he normally would? Would have made for a very difficult decision! |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2010 : 08:29:49
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Hey off ice injuries do happen. A couple that come to mind is Eric Johnson's golf cart incident, and Joe Sakic last winter with his snow blower!! So there's still hope! haha.
Actually i may not like Patrice Bergeron, but i wouldn't want to see anyones Olympic dreams shattered just a day before the games begin, especially a guy like him who's had such a rough go the last couple years. |
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willus3
Moderator
Canada
1948 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2010 : 08:48:12
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Getzlaf's injury, for me, highlights a flaw in Team Canada's selection process. I mentioned quite awhile ago in another thread that choosing players based on chemistry was not the best course. I still believe that and I think this injury shows why. Say what you want about Perry not being selected because of chemistry with Getzlaf, but that is the single biggest reason he was chosen. To play on Getzlaf's wing. He would not have made this team without that "chemistry" shown in the NHL. I didn't like him on the team when I heard the selections. Biggest reason being he's prone to taking bad penalties. Not a great thing in a tournament like this.
The other example is Keith/Seabrook. Had Keith been injured Seabrook would stand out on this team like a sore thumb. That's why, in my opinion, in a tournament such as this you need to take the best players possible. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2010 : 09:25:44
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quote:
Originally posted by willus3
Getzlaf's injury, for me, highlights a flaw in Team Canada's selection process. I mentioned quite awhile ago in another thread that choosing players based on chemistry was not the best course. I still believe that and I think this injury shows why. Say what you want about Perry not being selected because of chemistry with Getzlaf, but that is the single biggest reason he was chosen. To play on Getzlaf's wing. He would not have made this team without that "chemistry" shown in the NHL. I didn't like him on the team when I heard the selections. Biggest reason being he's prone to taking bad penalties. Not a great thing in a tournament like this.
The other example is Keith/Seabrook. Had Keith been injured Seabrook would stand out on this team like a sore thumb. That's why, in my opinion, in a tournament such as this you need to take the best players possible.
I dunno Willus....two things, first off, i think Perry would have a great shot at the team without Getzlaf. It's tough to say, but he's a tremendous mix of skill, size, etc and who knows where his career would be at had he say been drafted by maybe Ottawa or St. Louis (as examples). We'll never know, maybe he'd have found similar chemistry and possibly even better, with players from those teams? What if those players were from other countries? He might still very well be on this squad?
Secondly, chemistry in a short tournament like this is extremely important. I agree that Seabrook's in in place of a guy like JBo but let's not underestimate his skill. He too is an excellent player at this level. Perhaps he's an ever so slight downgrade from the package JBo offers, but the chemistry with Keith is obviuosly important and can't be dismissed. In a tournament like this, there's little time for gelling with your linemates and/or defensive partners! I'm okay with these picks....... |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2010 : 11:10:56
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I would agree 100% with Willus if this tourney was played outside of the NHL season. When there is time to mess with lines, try differet combos, and have have 2 week camp before the start of the tourney a la the Old Canada Cup or World Cup, the best possible players should and must be there.
However, when a tourney is 3 game to the medal round and the team literally has one practice before the games begin, it's (IMO) the team with the best and fastest chemistry that will have the best chance of winning. Having that Chemistry before the players even step on the ice is an advantage to Canada that some other nations might not have.
We are not talking about a pylon here. Perry has won at (and contributed)every level he has played at, from the OHL to the World Juniors. I don't recall Getzlaf playing with him at that point!
In fact, remember that line of Crosby - Bergeron - XXX at the World Juniors that was so dynamic and effective??
XXX - Was Corey Perry.
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/15/2010 : 15:10:10
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ryan93......still the best injury i can recall is Marty Cordoba (sp?) in MLB. Went on the DL after a home tanning mishap! Burned his face so bad he apparently couldn't play???
Beans, I didn't realize xxx was Perry. Would have been a good trivia question. |
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If Getzlaf can't play in the Olympics... 
