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Jumbo Joe Rocks
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
410 Posts |
 Posted - 08/02/2010 : 15:33:47
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quote:
Originally posted by Alex116
quote:
Originally posted by Tiller33
If you are the San Jose Sharks don't you now jump all over this guy???
Finally one where Jumbo Joe can rightfully claim SJ may be interested and he's not chimed in yet??? What gives Joe?
Because Niemi will not be a Sharks I want him to but what will happen to Greiss or maybe Niittymaki???DW has already said he is done with Goaltending.
GO SHARKS GO |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 16:25:39
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One team that will probably take a sniff - WSH. I don't believe they are that married to Varlarmov, and they are currently planning on going with him and Neuvirth. If they could get Niemi for 2.5-3 over a couple of years, that might be a good move for them. Both Varlamov and Neuvirth are in the last year of sub-1M deals. Varlamov looks to be getting the chance to prove himself, but Niemi could provide some insurance and a sweet tandem option.
Other than that, NYI could use him, and there was some speculation that the goaltending situation in MTL just got interesting again, as it seems Price is asking for more than they're willing to pay. I would not be surprised to see TB sniff around as well.
Truth is, there are not may places that he'll get a chance to be a starting goaltender, most other teams are locked up in that regard. He may have shot himself in the foot by letting this go to arbitration. |
Edited by - nuxfan on 08/02/2010 16:27:07 |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 17:43:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Tiller33
quote:
Originally posted by Beans15
Here's a question: What happens now as Niemi is a UFA. Does he HAVE to get paid at least $2.75 million based on his arbitrator or can a team sign him for anything(including less than that) now that he is a UFA??
I'm prettty sure at least the first year has to match or increase the arbitrator's offer and any following years will be between niemi's agent and the respective team to negotiate.
I think you are a bit hard on Niemi Beans, look at the last rookie goalie to win a Stanley Cup Cam Ward. His next contract he got $2.7 and that was in 2007 with a cap cieling in the mid $40 millions. Adjusted for inflation I think the arbitrator was bang on. If he had of came down with an awrard higher than $3 than I htink think the Hawks would have been right to walk away but I think they are making a mistake here. If there is one position on the ice you don't go into a season with question marks it's goaltending.
If you are the San Jose Sharks don't you now jump all over this guy???
One could argue that Ward was one of the biggest reasons they won the Cup that year. He was also the Conn Smythe winner, something Niemi was not. And correct me if I am wrong, but Ward was signed by the GM, not through arbitration. That is the issue I have is that if a GM wants to be a tool and sign a goalie with limited experience to a bad contract (Jose Theodore, Jaroslav Halak, etc) then fine. But arbitration kind of sets the bar and this is basically saying that a goalies contract is based on the very short term success they may have.
Here's the thing with goalies, it is easily the most difficult position in the NHL to play and consistant play is rare. Think about this. Marty Turco, 2 seasons ago, was one of the top 5-10 goalies in the NHL. He had 6 consecutive 30+ win seasons including a 40 win season. He was relegate to the bench and was not a very highly sought after UFA. And I know he is getting up there in years, but another guy is Toskala. He was top 10 in wins just 2 seasons ago. Now, where is he??
All I am saying is that it's a huge risk to pay a young, unproven goalie top dollar and. although I like Niemi, I don't see him as an elite goalie in the NHL today or in the future. However, he is getting paid higher than guys that have proven a lot more than he has.
When arbitrators start dropping big cash on short term success, it opens the door for more and more RFA's to take the arbitration route. |
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Tiller33
PickupHockey Pro
389 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 18:26:44
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The sky is up (Beans this is where you say it is down). How can you argue that these arbitratoion decisions are dangerous and will lead to problems while defending the 17 year monstrosity Kovalchuck signed. Young players being overpaid for one year compared to players being overpaid for 11 years then vastly underpaid for 6?
I think it will be really interesting what Price ends up signing for now that the market has been clarified a little between Halak, Turco, Niemi, Ellis signing
I still think $2.75 mil for a guy with a ring (talk up the defence all you want he still has to stop the pucks) and who had 7 shutouts in 39 regular season games is a real bargain. The deal is only for a year if you accept the arbitrators ruling if he plays well its a great deal and you hammer out a long term deal. On the flip side if he poops the proverbial bed then you let him walk. $2.75 mil for one year is nicer than a guy making $5.6 mil for the next 2 oh wait, they already have one of those. |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 19:18:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Tiller33
The sky is up (Beans this is where you say it is down). How can you argue that these arbitratoion decisions are dangerous and will lead to problems while defending the 17 year monstrosity Kovalchuck signed. Young players being overpaid for one year compared to players being overpaid for 11 years then vastly underpaid for 6?
I think it will be really interesting what Price ends up signing for now that the market has been clarified a little between Halak, Turco, Niemi, Ellis signing
I still think $2.75 mil for a guy with a ring (talk up the defence all you want he still has to stop the pucks) and who had 7 shutouts in 39 regular season games is a real bargain. The deal is only for a year if you accept the arbitrators ruling if he plays well its a great deal and you hammer out a long term deal. On the flip side if he poops the proverbial bed then you let him walk. $2.75 mil for one year is nicer than a guy making $5.6 mil for the next 2 oh wait, they already have one of those.
The thing with price is different he has no arbitration rights,, why its takeing so long for him to sign is Gauthier is trying to get him to sign for a longer term,,, so if he is the next Roy the habs can be paying him somewhere around 2 million.,... basicly Price is guranteed to have to take what the habs offer ,, or wait out for the begining of the season
Pasty |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 19:32:20
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quote:
or wait out for the begining of the season
or get an offer sheet from another team that wants to sign him. The longer the Price situation goes, the more likely an offer sheet becomes, which then forces MTL's hand a bit. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 19:39:23
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quote:
Here's a question: What happens now as Niemi is a UFA. Does he HAVE to get paid at least $2.75 million based on his arbitrator or can a team sign him for anything(including less than that) now that he is a UFA??
This is actually one part of the CBA that I do not agree with. My understanding is that any team can sign him to any deal that they want - except CHI. If CHI wants to sign him now, they MUST pay the arbitration amount and term. However, any other team can sign him for less than that amount if they choose.
I recall this happening a while back, with a forward from the east (don't remember who - Peca?). They were essentially given an award, the team walked away, and another team signed him for less than the arbitration amount - but his original team could not do so.
Can anyone confirm? |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 19:43:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Tiller33
The sky is up (Beans this is where you say it is down). How can you argue that these arbitratoion decisions are dangerous and will lead to problems while defending the 17 year monstrosity Kovalchuck signed. Young players being overpaid for one year compared to players being overpaid for 11 years then vastly underpaid for 6?
I think it will be really interesting what Price ends up signing for now that the market has been clarified a little between Halak, Turco, Niemi, Ellis signing
I still think $2.75 mil for a guy with a ring (talk up the defence all you want he still has to stop the pucks) and who had 7 shutouts in 39 regular season games is a real bargain. The deal is only for a year if you accept the arbitrators ruling if he plays well its a great deal and you hammer out a long term deal. On the flip side if he poops the proverbial bed then you let him walk. $2.75 mil for one year is nicer than a guy making $5.6 mil for the next 2 oh wait, they already have one of those.
Firstly, I totally see the point of the one year deal and I completely agree with that as it would be REALLY unfair for an arbitrator to saddle a team with a garbage contract(like this Niemi deal) for longer than one season. If he would have signed to the deal in Chicago and played a 35 wins season with another Cup (or at least a deep playoff run) then I guess I would have egg on my face. I guess we will never know.
Here's the difference between the Niemi getting #1 goalie wages when he did not play even a single season as a #1 and the Kovalchuk thing is that they are two very separate and different issues. One is establishing the bar for goalies salaries in the future while the other is rules towards an established practice.
One is setting a precedent and one is upholding it.
At the end of the day, the Cup winning piece has t be qualified. Is Neimi the reason the Hawks won the Cup or made it to the Cup(a la Ward in 06, Roy(twice), Giguere(twice, winning once), Roloson, Ranford, Fehr) or did Niemi win the Cup by being on the far superior team (Khabibulin, Osgood (like 15 times), Barasso, Vernon(a few times) etc)???
The Ring is only worth the big cash when it can be said with some reasonability that the Ring would not be there save the goalie. Think about this for a second, Put Niemi in Philly's net and Leighton in Chicago's, do you think the outcome is different??
One of them is getting about $1.5 million and one is apparently worth nearly double that.
So basically, a goalie should be paid for playing on a better team?? Is that what I am hearing?? The Niemi arbitration is between $750,000 and $1 million heavy. If he played great the next season, he would have be paid either by the team or as a UFA. I don't like how the arbitrator forced the teams hand when he has not proved much. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 19:46:26
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it was JP Dumont.
In 2006, he was awarded a 1yr 2.9M deal in arbitration, which BUF walked away from. Later that year he signed a 2yr/4.5M deal (for an avg of 2.25M).
There are probably others, but that is the one I remember most recently. In that case, NAS was essentially allowed to present an offer that BUF was not allowed to make. |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 19:49:08
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@ Beans:
I guess we disagree quite a bit on this one.
To me, signing Niemi to a 1-year deal, at under $3M ($2.75) is a fair price. You give your #1 netminder a chance to prove him self in a full season, after helping win you a Stanley Cup.
We can say how good the defense was, how awesome the offense was, but at the end of the day, Niemi did his job too. And, it helped win them the Cup.
And, of the goaltenders you have mentioned making the same amount as Niemi or less, how many have a Stanley Cup ring and are under the age of 30? Better yet, under 34?
Likely not many.
I think giving Niemi the chance, for that price, is fair value. He has not played a lot of regular season games, but he did excellent during those games. He also stepped up when it counted, in the playoffs.
Did he steal a series? No. But, he didn't lose one either. He held his own, and held it well. In goaltending, asking for a lot more some times is what gets you in trouble.
You want your goalie to give your team a chance to win games, night in, night out. Niemi did that.
At $2.75M per, for perhaps the most important position in hockey, is value to me.
I don't see this ruling to be that far off, if not exact on. What do you feel he deserves, Beans?
Irvine/prez. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 20:01:49
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@ Irvine.
What did Osgood get per season after winning his 3rd Cup and playing in nearly 700 NHL games with a better than .500 win %??
I'll tell you right now, it was far less than what Niemi was awarded in Arbitration. The difference between Niemi and other Cup winning goalies to get their payday after winning the Mug is that most of those keepers were established and had history.
As I said, I think a deal for one year between $1.75 and $2.0 million which would put him right in the heart of the UFA NHL goalies this season. I compare Niemi to a guy like John Quick or Josh Harding. Is Niemi out right better or worse than either of those two guys?? No, not at all. It's very close. However, one of them played on a far better team so one of them is apparently worth $1 million more per season.
Granted, a young goalie who can hold up his end of the bargin to win the Cup is worth something, but is it $1 million??? Obviously Chicago did not think so. The most interesting piece of this to me is that none of you can tell me with any kind of logic that Chicago will be worse off paying Turco $1.5 million less this coming season than they would have been with Niemi in net.
Niemi(or his agent) was greedy. He could have signed in Chicago for less and been on a winner. Instead, he is on the outside looking in without a job. Honest, who is out there looking for a goalie today?? |
Edited by - Beans15 on 08/02/2010 20:03:39 |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 20:16:07
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To supposrt beans furthur,, do you really think anyone is gonna give Neimi his 2.75 milion? i would be extremly surprised if on the open market some Gm feels he is worth that,, espcially when their are limited teams looking for goalies at this point in the offseason, even at 35 i take Turco everyday and twice on sunday over Neimi even at the same price tag,,,
Pasty |
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Sensfan101
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
500 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 20:32:04
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Erik Johnson signs a 2 year 5.2 million dollar contract in St. Louis.
You miss 100 percent of the shots you don't take Wayne Gretzky |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 20:59:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Sensfan101
Erik Johnson signs a 2 year 5.2 million dollar contract in St. Louis.
You miss 100 percent of the shots you don't take Wayne Gretzky
Now this to me is a deal that is about as dead on as it can be. A player who is huge, mobile, can play in any situations, and is good for at least 40 points a season is worth a ton. However, he has played just 2 NHL season.
Has proved a little something but is still young so has to prove it a little longer before he gets huge jack.
Consider that in Johnson's 2 season he has produced more in both seasons than Hamhuis ever has and is getting $2 million a season less.
At least some NHL GM's still have some logic. Although, this is the same GM who signed Halak to almost $4 million a season. |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 21:34:08
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Chicago, with the situation they are in, had little choice in the matter. Of course they took Turco for less.
And, I never said I would not take Turco over Niemi, for a one year period.
But when I look at the list of goalies making $2.00M - $3.8M ( a wider margin than I had to use... as $3.8M is $1M more than $2.75M)
I see a list of goaltenders with a lot left to prove (like Niemi), or guys who are ready for retirement. (Roloson, Khabibulin).
And, if I'm going to pay a goaltender that price range, why not the only guy on that list with the Cup ring & is under 30 years of age?
Can we say, honestly, that these guys are all better than Niemi is now?
Leclaire, Pascal
Khabibulin, Nikolai
Halak, Jaroslav
Lehtonen, Kari
Rinne, Pekka
Roloson, Dwayne
Smith, Mike
Niittymaki, Antero
They all are goaltenders who are NHL caliber. But, are any of them, honestly, better than a 26-year old goaltender with a Cup ring as a rookie? Not to me. Especialy since Rolly is 40 and Khabiublin is nearing 40, and injured.
What I am getting at is, his salary is not that far fetched. We've seen little of him, but, at the end of the day a Cup ring counts in the NHL. No matter the team in front of you, he had to do his part.
And, looking at the goaltenders behind him in salary (after the list I just presented), they are all either (for the most part)
A) Career NHL Back-ups
B) Young goaltenders, on rookie contracts
C) Odd exception of solid stater over a long career, but are aged out now. Not likely to sign big money deals. But, I bet they did at one point. Likely, even more than $2.75M
Niemi is a guy who just took over reigns in Chicago, as their #1 Goaltender. Who, again, won the Cup as a starter.
Not guys who have been playing back-up roles, or are fresh in the league like Niemi, but under 3-year entry level deals.
Once those guys, such as Rask, are eligable, they'll receive pay similar.
Also, Craig Anderson makes $2.125M this season, and Quick makes $1.9M this year. (they just have lower cap hits).
$600K more isn't a hefty raise (when compared), since LA nor Colorado won the Cup. ;)
Irvine/prez. |
Edited by - irvine on 08/02/2010 21:44:16 |
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MrBoogedy
Rookie
Canada
195 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 22:42:35
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| Andy Sutton signs with Anaheim for 2 years, $4.25 mil. |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 22:45:23
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Other news regarding movements/signings:
Glen Metropolit inks 2-year deal with EV Zug of the Swiss League.
Finances of the deal were not disclosed as of yet.
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Anaheim Ducks have inked (D) Andy Sutton to a 2-year contract. The deal is worth $4.25M
Sutton should add a defensive aspect to the Ducks blueline. Sutton, finished 2nd in the NHL in blocked shots last year. He also is a hard nosed, hard hitting d-man.
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Buffalo Sabres have put Tim Kennedy on Waivers just a short time after Kennedy inked a new deal with Buffalo, that was ruled on by an arbitrator.
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The Buffalo Sabres have made another move. This time, acquiring D-man Shaone Morrissonn.
The deal is for 2-years. Dollars unknown.
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Lastly, the New York Islanders have bought-out the contract of defensemen Brendan Witt.
The contract was for 2-years, $6M. He had 1-year left, worth $3M on his contract.
Irvine/prez. |
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MrBoogedy
Rookie
Canada
195 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 22:48:29
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| What the hell is Montreal doing? Halak, Moore, Metropolit. They just got rid of all of their unsung heroes... all the guys that stepped up that were not expected to, and now they're gone. grrrrrr!!!! |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2010 : 22:50:24
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I love the Ducks signing of Sutton. Sutton is aging, but he still provides a solid defensive game. He will get in the lanes and block shots, he also does not shy away from using his body. And, he uses it well.
Sutton is a team player who, should help solidify the Ducks back-end after losing Neidermayer.
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The Sabres signing of Morrisonn is good for the Sabres. Morrisonn is not a big name, or big time defencemen. But, he will help round out their back-end. He's not a big game changer, but after losing Tallinder & Lydman, the Sabres are in big need on the backend.
I think this should help.
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I find it a bit hard to believe no team had an interest in Metropolit (for their 4th line). Apparently, his asking price was too high.
He must be getting paid good money to decide to leave the NHL for the Swiss League, at this point in his career. $2M? or more?
Irvine/prez. |
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Jumbo Joe Rocks
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
410 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 05:48:00
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Mike Modano has reportedly signed a 1 year deal with Detroit???
GO SHARKS GO |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 06:15:59
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Well, I guess we will have to agree to disagree Irvine. The question you ask about who is better than Niemi today, I take everyone on your list with the exception of Mike Smith and Pascal Leclaire. He is another perfect example of young goalies getting big money and not holding up their end of the bargin.
Regardless, Niemi is not an elite goalie today or tomorrow and ultimately, he has only proven to be a #1 goalie for about 60 games. That's just not enough in my opinion.
I also like the Sutton signing. He is better than people give him credit for. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 09:09:52
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quote:
Now this to me is a deal that is about as dead on as it can be. A player who is huge, mobile, can play in any situations, and is good for at least 40 points a season is worth a ton. However, he has played just 2 NHL season.
Has proved a little something but is still young so has to prove it a little longer before he gets huge jack.
Consider that in Johnson's 2 season he has produced more in both seasons than Hamhuis ever has and is getting $2 million a season less.
At least some NHL GM's still have some logic. Although, this is the same GM who signed Halak to almost $4 million a season.
Beans, why such a hate-on for Hamhuis? Why compare these two defensemen - they are different dmen at different points in their careers.
I think the main reasons that Johnson is getting less is:
1. He has only been an NHL player for just under 2 seasons
2. He missed the entire 08/09 season with torn MCL and ACL, and has only played 1 full season on that reconstructed knee
3. He had no arbitration rights this year, due to that missed year.
If he does what he did last year for 2 more years, then he'll most likely see a contract that pays far more than Hamhuis ever sees. Because they are different defencemen. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 11:03:00
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Just to chime in on the goalie signing debate, Beans - Barrasso was not a guy who had a superior team, I'd reckon, even with Lemieux and Jagr at the front end. They had a pretty weak defence, all in all. Plus, he won the Vezina and Calder as an 18 year old in 1984, quite a few years before he won his two cups. He also holds the record for most assists and points (48) by a goaltender, strangely enough. And he is in the US Hockey Hall of Fame.
Yeah, his career save percentage was barely over .900, but he did play in the late 80s and early 90s, and he was known as a money goaltender - certainly not someone who, in his heyday, could be referred to as "flash in the pan" or "average".
As to the Jack Johnson signing - compared to the Hamhuis signing, it's dirt cheap. I disagree with nuxfan, however - Johnson is not that different than Hamhuis, other than that he brings a bit more physicality to the table, and has more potential, and is seen as a potential leader/captain in the future.
In today's NHL, the Blues got him cheap . . . but a lot of that may have something to do with injuries, not for being 'unproven'.
Great signing by Chicago to get Turco . . . I predict a big bounce-back year from Turco. Easy team to goaltend for, as the defence is great and the offence covers up the odd bad game. Perfect situation for both Chicago and Turco, as the Hawks could get amazing value for their dollar if Marty returns to form from even two years back.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 11:16:39
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It's hard for me to weigh in on the Niemi contract, if for no other reason than i find myself somewhere in the middle. I think it's a little high, but certainly not a mil+ high. Maybe 400k? Anything in the 2.25-2.5mil range would have been good with me so i don't find it grossly overvalued?
The scary part for Chicago is that if he does get a chance elsewhere and excels, they could find themselves kicking themselves for years to come? But, i suppose these are the risks teams take every time a situation like this arises. The fact that it was only a one year deal makes me a little surprised Chi didn't suck it up and pay him if for no other reason to find out just how good he is or could be? Of course, with the corner they've backed themselves into salary-wise, i guess maybe they simply couldn't take that chance?
The other thing to consider is what were they offering him? The must have tried to lock him up for 4 or 5 years at a figure i'm guessing would be avg'ing 2.3-2.4? Or were they lowballing him there too?
While he may not have been Conn Smythe calibre in his playoff play, he did play well and was a difference maker at times. I know i focussed mostly on the Canucks / Hawks series but i have to say, he made HUGE saves when his team needed him to the most, some of which arguably were game changing!
It's gonna be interesting to see what happens with this 26 year old "kid". |
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Jumbo Joe Rocks
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
410 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 12:41:16
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 San Jose signs Jamal Mayers to a 1 year contract
GO SHARKS GO |
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Jumbo Joe Rocks
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
410 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 12:48:48
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Jamal Mayer's contract is 1 year $600k
It was out of the blue though I thought he retired??
GO SHARKS GO |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 13:01:14
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quote:
As to the Jack Johnson signing - compared to the Hamhuis signing, it's dirt cheap. I disagree with nuxfan, however - Johnson is not that different than Hamhuis, other than that he brings a bit more physicality to the table, and has more potential, and is seen as a potential leader/captain in the future.
In today's NHL, the Blues got him cheap . . . but a lot of that may have something to do with injuries, not for being 'unproven'.
The Blues got him cheap, because he really had no other recourse. He has no arbitration rights, he cannot be offersheeted, and he's RFA. He was bent over a barrel, and the Blues took advantage. You can argue whether or not he is proven, I would say that he is still in the "bright prospect with lots of upside" category.
Johnston and Hamhuis are in different stages of their careers, play in different situations (or have up until this year), and are in different circumstances status-wise. Hence, different contracts.
Apparently, his agent was asking for a longer term deal in the 4-5M range, and the Blues said no. They offered the shorter term deal, with full knowledge that if/when he lights it up for that contract, his next one will likely be long term and would also be at least 5 per year (if not more). Like I said, if he does this deal and continues to produce like he has, he'll be making far more than Hamhuis does, and deservedly so. |
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Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 14:50:00
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quote:
Originally posted by Jumbo Joe Rocks
Jamal Mayer's contract is 1 year $600k
It was out of the blue though I thought he retired??
GO SHARKS GO
Can anyone confirm this? I looked on tsn and nhl.com and got nothing about it.
CANUCKS RULE!!!
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 15:01:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Canucks Man
quote:
Originally posted by Jumbo Joe Rocks
Jamal Mayer's contract is 1 year $600k
It was out of the blue though I thought he retired??
GO SHARKS GO
Can anyone confirm this? I looked on tsn and nhl.com and got nothing about it.
CANUCKS RULE!!!
its a confirmed no! the sharks official web page says nothing about it and as you pointed out neither does tsn or any other credible sources
Pasty |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2010 : 22:35:02
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quote:
Originally posted by nuxfan
quote:
Now this to me is a deal that is about as dead on as it can be. A player who is huge, mobile, can play in any situations, and is good for at least 40 points a season is worth a ton. However, he has played just 2 NHL season.
Has proved a little something but is still young so has to prove it a little longer before he gets huge jack.
Consider that in Johnson's 2 season he has produced more in both seasons than Hamhuis ever has and is getting $2 million a season less.
At least some NHL GM's still have some logic. Although, this is the same GM who signed Halak to almost $4 million a season.
Beans, why such a hate-on for Hamhuis? Why compare these two defensemen - they are different dmen at different points in their careers.
I think the main reasons that Johnson is getting less is:
1. He has only been an NHL player for just under 2 seasons
2. He missed the entire 08/09 season with torn MCL and ACL, and has only played 1 full season on that reconstructed knee
3. He had no arbitration rights this year, due to that missed year.
If he does what he did last year for 2 more years, then he'll most likely see a contract that pays far more than Hamhuis ever sees. Because they are different defencemen.
I don't have a hate on for Hamhuis. In fact, I have applauded his skills as one of the best #3 defensemen in the league. But that is what he is, a #3 defensemen.
I am foiling the best defensemen signing(Johnson) with the worst(Hamhuis). Hamhuis is grossly overpaid for what he has produced in his career and one of the only reasons why is that there were so few puck moving defensemen in the UFA crop this season and Vancouver was so desparate for one it was sick. Once Gonchar was off the market, Hamhuis was the next best. Which is why he not only got about $1-$1.5 million more a season than what he is worth but he also got it for 6 years.
In 2 seasons when Johnson's contract is up again, he is still an RFA(under 27 and less than 7 NHL seasons). At that time, if he has 4 straight 40ish point seasons, then St. Louis will lock him up long term and pay him(agreed it will be far bigger than anything Hamhuis will ever see). Or they go to an arbitrator or someone signs him to an offer sheet and St. Louis cleans up with draft picks.
It's simply a comparison and anyway you look at it, Johnson's deal has it in spades over the Hamhuis deal. Rightly or wrongly, they are the two deals I find the best and the worst. |
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deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2010 : 04:56:25
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Well, as nuxfan adroitly pointed out, Johnson's agent was mightily handcuffed, so yeah, the Blues got a major steal.
He's a 6-4, 219lb kid (for his age, that's enormous) that already has seasons of 33 and 39 points, and he scored 10 goals last year - his sophomore year. This kid will be a star, mark my words, and his ceiling hasn't been determined yet, but this could be another Pronger-type in the making, in terms of the potential offence and physicality he brings to the table. Next couple of years could see him enter the 45+ point elite defencemen category, and I hear he's not a huge defensive liability (still young). He is a second defenceman now; easily could be one of the top ten d-men in the future and certainly looks to be a #1 very soon.
As Beans pointed out however, Hamhuis' ceiling has already been determined - he may not ever get over 30 points, he's pretty good defensively but not great, and he's no pushover but also not overly physical. A third defenceman.
And what's the big fuss over Mayers? I can't find a bigger "ho-hum" moment than San Jose, a very deep team to begin with, signing this lazy player (yes, lazy - at least in Toronto he was) with little defensive responsibility as some sort of a "grit" signing. He is a reclamation project with a very small chance of success, in my estimation.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Pasty7
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
2312 Posts |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2010 : 09:06:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Jumbo Joe Rocks
Mike Modano has reportedly signed a 1 year deal with Detroit???
GO SHARKS GO
According to a quote from Modano, he talked to current and former Wings prior to making the decision, including Brett Hull. Pretty class act in Hull, who is still involved with the Stars as an Executive VP. He apparently told Modano how great Detroit treats their players and how much he enjoyed it there.
Although some may disagree and say that Dallas owed something to Modano and if he still wanted to play they should have signed him. However, I think this was a classy way for the Stars to let Modano go. They were not going to sign up but still seemed to care enough to help him make the decision to go to Detroit.
I think I want to see Modano win the Cup again. Go Detroit Go! |
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Jumbo Joe Rocks
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
410 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2010 : 10:21:37
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According to Hockey Buzz Carey Price will sign with the Canadiens.
GO SHARKS GO |
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Jumbo Joe Rocks
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
410 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2010 : 12:50:41
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On Jamal Mayers player profile on NHL.Com it says he is on SJ??
GO SHARKS GO |
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Jumbo Joe Rocks
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
410 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2010 : 12:53:08
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And on San Jose Sharks.Com he is on their roster that could confirm the signing.1 year $600k.I hope we get the Mayers from St.Louis nont Calgary and Toronto
GO SHARKS GO |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2010 : 13:37:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Jumbo Joe Rocks
And on San Jose Sharks.Com he is on their roster that could confirm the signing.1 year $600k.I hope we get the Mayers from St.Louis nont Calgary and Toronto
GO SHARKS GO
Does it mattr which one it is?? They are all useless. He is a plug in a roster. A guy who can take up 5-7 minutes a game and take up space. He's a pylon getting paid $600k a season.
The symptom of the salary cap. Spend all you cash on the stars and be forced to fill in a roster with meatball's like Jamal Mayers. |
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Jumbo Joe Rocks
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
410 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2010 : 15:18:46
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Well just sayin Jamal mayers has signed a 1 year deal with San Jose Sharks worth $600k.It is confirmed now by San Jose Sharks.Com.
GO SHARKS GO |
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deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2010 : 08:07:05
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. . . and Jumbo Joe, WE are just saying that Jamal Mayers is a meatball (the term made me lol). Beans, trust me - a lazy meatball. When a team like last year's Leafs, desperate for size and grit, let him go after ever diminishing minutes . . . it says something.
I think Modano might be ok in Detroit, but I still would have liked to see him in Minnesota instead. A big "meh" from me.
Breaking News from Yesterday: Blues sign Dave Scatchard.
(yawn)
Let's get this show on the road, people! Will the arbitor give a judgement already on the Kovie deal, and then we can all move on here?!?
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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