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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
 Posted - 02/17/2011 : 09:32:46
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quote:
I believe you are arguing for the sake of arguing and can't admit something in black and white. That list is as clear as day. 90%+ of those players are(or were) day to day NHL players. 70%+ of those players have been All Stars in their career. As I said, a top 5 pick is as close to a sure thing that happens in the NHL. Boston would give that up for Kaberle?? I don't think so.
I'm not arguing for the sake of arguing - sure, the past decade of drafts have been bountiful indeed. I am simply stating that the TOR pick is not necessarily out of play at all costs. Beans, its not even a top-5 pick right now, and the way TOR are playing recently, it has a chance of not even being a top-10 pick!
At the end of the day, BOS management are a bunch of pretty smart hockey guys. Knowing that they have this pick, they very likely have a thick folder prepared on every serious prospect that is draft-eligible for this coming year. They have some in-depth knowledge on every prospect that could be picked in the first round, and certainly in the top-10 - they probably have a ranking of their own as well. Further, they are probably weighing the odds of where this pick is going to place, as its a moving target, and making decisions based on those odds.
If BOS management at the end of it all, thinks that the 2 or 3 players that they are likely to get (based on their own ranking and where they think the TOR pick is likely to end up) are not as good potential-wise as Kaberle (locked up for the next 4 years) is now, then its a pretty easy decision to deal it. If they do like the player that they can get with the pick they think TOR will provide, then they'll keep it. |
Edited by - nuxfan on 02/17/2011 09:33:42 |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 09:53:21
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Don't change the argument now! You stated you believed the trade of Kaberle of the 1st round pick TO traded to Boston would be reasonable if Kaberle signed for 3-4 years. That was your point and that is what I have been arguing. I never stated the pick is completely off the table either, so I don't know what you are getting at.
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 11:04:05
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Honestly, I think it would come down more to what Boston feel they are capable of in the next 3 seasons, if they added Kaberle. If Boston feel he helps give them a legit shot at the cup, within the next few seasons, I don't think trading Toronto's pick back to them would be an idea they'd not consider, contingent on re-signing Kaberle.
The Bruins have a team now, that is capable (with some tweaking), of making a cup run. That's the whole purpose of the NHL, besides making money.
Boston have a good mixture of young for the future, and veterans for the now. At the cost of another potential player, for a proven veteran that would prove useful to them and to their goal, i can't see why they would not consider it.
Of course Boston would prefer trading their 1st round pick for him, all teams want a player cheap as possible. But if BOS really feel Kaberle is the answer on their blueline, and Burke holds out for that pick, I really think Boston will consider it.
Irvine/prez. |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 11:26:17
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I remember that now Toxxic, had heard that clip as well by Burke that the 1st pick that was now Boston's wasn't in play.
So I can only guess then that Burke is holding out for better than Wheeler or more, or Chiarelli wants to keep Wheeler and Campbell and anyone else Burke may want.
They are two shrewd guys, and you gotta know Burke does not want to do another deal with Boston that allows the media to slag him like they have over the Kessel deal.
I am now starting to think the deal may never happen, and Kaberle stays a Leaf forever, lol.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug
Ha ha . . . and no sooner do I post the above, when I get this sports ticker update:
Report: Kaberle Deal Close
CSNNE.com's Joe Haggerty is reporting that a deal of Toronto Maple Leafs D Tomas Kaberle to the Boston Bruins for a package believed to be F Blake Wheeler and a draft pick is close to being complete. The Bruins are also reportedly working on a trade of D Mark Stuart to the Chicago Blackhawks in order to create salary cap flexibility. |
Edited by - n/a on 02/17/2011 11:29:02 |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 11:36:38
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| There you go. Probably Wheeler and Boston's 1st? |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 11:40:08
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quote:
Don't change the argument now! You stated you believed the trade of Kaberle of the 1st round pick TO traded to Boston would be reasonable if Kaberle signed for 3-4 years. That was your point and that is what I have been arguing. I never stated the pick is completely off the table either, so I don't know what you are getting at.
Hm, ok, looking back I did say that. My bad choice of words then. I certainly think it *could* be reasonable, given the pick is a moving target and not set in stone. Blah, whatever, sounds like we're argufying the same thing.
Sounds like its a moot point anyway, if BB and BOS both say that its not in play, the pending Kaberle deal must be for other things. |
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Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro
735 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 12:27:01
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| Thinking of it, I wonder if Burke sent Versteeg to Philly on purpose, because he knew this would put pressure on Boston to improve their team, if they want to beat Philly in the playoffs. |
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Guest2712
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Posted - 02/17/2011 : 12:45:42
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| funny, that article refers to a report from Darren Dregger at TSN. but then at the same time Bob McKenzie, also of TSN, is apparently "tweeting" that Wheeler isn't part of the Kaberle deal. conflicting reports from the same media source? wtf??? |
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JonPolley
Top Prospect
Canada
49 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 13:35:22
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| Ok so there are rumours that edm could trade Penner to the Canadiens for whoever or whatever. Do you think if that is going to happen tthat they will use the game tonight to do it and sit out Penner and whoever is involved in the trade. And if they don't sit out Penner tonight does that mean their will be no trade or is there still time? Thoughts? |
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Porkchop73
PickupHockey Pro
640 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 14:51:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Leafs81
Thinking of it, I wonder if Burke sent Versteeg to Philly on purpose, because he knew this would put pressure on Boston to improve their team, if they want to beat Philly in the playoffs.
Conspiracy thoeries, I love it, and it actually could have happened. What if it is Bostons first rounder in a deal. BB just picked up two first round picks in 2011(phillies) and could look a making a bigger splash with those picks in a package for an RFA again. Uh oh, then Burkes theory of rebuilding without spending 10 years in the basement to collect top 3 picks over and over again starts to come to life. I don't know if he can do it but he sure is trying. |
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The Duke
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1239 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 15:09:48
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Brian Burke would ( i think ) trade Kaberle straight up for Wheeler if he could, let alone a draft pick, i know i would jump at it.
Young player with his size, 6` 5`` i think. Straight up Toronto wins this trade....Wheeler and a late 1st rd pick.....this deal would be a steal for Toronto. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/17/2011 : 17:06:49
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Holy Crap, I agree with Duke! I think people are underestimating Blake Wheeler in this deal. He has been a bit of an odd-man out in Boston but even playing around 16 minutes a game he has shown 20 goal chops. Plus, he is HUGE. He is taller than Lucic and just 15 lbs ligher. He is a tank. Maybe I am forgetting the past, but didn't Kessel play with Savard and Wheeler when both Kessel and Wheeler had their best seasons??
I like the Wheeler deal for the Leafs. Giving that team Kessel and Wheeler with the breakout of Grabovksi and Kulemin, this Leafs team who started the year with maybe one legitimate top 6 foward will go into next season with at least 4.
I can see the draft pick being a 3-4 round pick but maybe move to a 2nd round pick if Kaberle signs with Boston in the offseason. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 05:21:46
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Listened to Burke's short quote on the FAN590 this morning . . . I had to laugh to myself, because of course, the Kaberle deal isn't, perhaps, a lock to go down.
In response to the rumour that the Kaberle to Boston deal was almost done: "No, those rumours are all wrong . . . talks are ongoing."
Loooooooooots of talking. No action.
Yeah - I'd be happy with Wheeler for Kaberle straight up I guess, but I have to think Burke might press for more. Again, it's the thing I talked about in another thread, where any GM does not want to be known as the guy who dealt the one missing piece perhaps to an eventual Stanley Cup win, without making that team overpay.
And that's fair. Kaberle could re-sign with Boston, they are in the same division, and we don't want to be known as the guys who built Boston into a championship team.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 05:59:01
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I read somewhere that the hold up is Boston needing to move a different player to a different team before dealing for Kabby. Cap issues......
Jonpolley:
Any word on Wisnewski? He caught all of that puck in the face last night, between Habs and Canucks, defencemen are an endagered species. |
Edited by - ToXXiK1 on 02/18/2011 06:01:26 |
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JonPolley
Top Prospect
Canada
49 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 06:45:02
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Jonpolley:
Any word on Wisnewski? He caught all of that puck in the face last night, between Habs and Canucks, defencemen are an endagered species.
haven't heard any official reports but its a face injury, can't see it keeping him out for an extended period of time.. they 'll stitch him up.. slap a cage on him and send him out again.. I mean what choice do they have really? |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 07:19:04
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Yeah Toxxic - word is, the hold-up is Stuart being moved out, possibly to Chicago.
This would then free up cap space for Kaberle going to Beantown, and Wheeler giong to Toronto.
YET ANOTHER monkey wrench has been thrown in, and it is reportedly coming from the Montreal Gazette reporters (totally unconfirmed guys, heard this from a third party source):
Supposedly, the Boston/Kaberle deal was put on hold at the last minute, as a bunch of teams jumped in with better / very good offers. Supposedly, someone offered two 1st rounders . . . and that was reportedly Washington. Montreal has also put in a bid supposedly. And also reportedly, Kaberle has ok'ed a move to any of those teams (Wash, Mont, Boston).
There is also ANOTHER team that put itself into play by offering Cody Hodgson . . . yep, the Canucks. Hodgson is much-coveted by Burke, so supposedly it's a full-on bidding war.
If this huge rumour had come from Toronto, I'd have said hogwash, it's just TO talk . . . but coming from Montreal, I don't know . . . and let's face it, defencemen are going down everywhere, so some depseration has crept in here.
As a Toronto fan looking at a Kaberle deal, I would love to see some desperation! 
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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JonPolley
Top Prospect
Canada
49 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 07:33:42
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| I think the Habs would have to give up way too much for Kab.. plus Im guessing part of the deal would be one of the Habs goaltenders in the minors..which I can't see them letting go. |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 07:43:20
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| Sounds like BB might get his wish of the 1st's he wants. I guess the wait and see game applies here. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 09:04:13
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quote:
There is also ANOTHER team that put itself into play by offering Cody Hodgson . . . yep, the Canucks. Hodgson is much-coveted by Burke, so supposedly it's a full-on bidding war.
There has been nothing in the local papers about this, we would have seen something if there was anything to this rumour. The Canucks have no way to fit him under the cap. They have space to take a player with a contract of about 1M over the year.
They also have no need for him, unless they suspect that Edler might be out for the remainder of the season and playoffs. |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 09:28:41
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well, I should clarify I suppose - they have no room, unless they move someone else to make room...
I see local rumours that the Canucks are interested in Blake Wheeler or Blake Comeau, and would perhaps be willing to move Raymond...
Just rumours right now. |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 09:31:38
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I just read an update on Dreger's report:
*** - Editor's Note from Hockey Insider Bob McKenzie at 12:19pm et: It appears as if Tomas Kaberle has been asked to waive his NTC to go to the Boston Bruins. There is every reason to believe he will sign it and the deal will now unfold.
Anytime now by the sound of it...... Also read Wisnewski out for 4 weeks. |
Edited by - ToXXiK1 on 02/18/2011 09:35:32 |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 09:44:19
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There shouldn't be a shortage of teams interested in Kaberle. The teams wanting to improve (WAS/BOS) and the teams with injuries(MONT/VAN) as well as others (TB, DAL, etc) that might want to make a run at the Cup.
I think the biggest difference this year over the past few years is that Burke seems willing to listen to all offers, not just some offers. I believe there is no doubt in anyone's mind that Kaberle will not be a Leaf next year regardless, so Burke will get something. I am impressed with the circus Burke can stir up to keep people interested. He will get a good value for Kaberle which should make Leaf fans happy. That is unless Kaberle is hoisting the mug in 4 months. |
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JonPolley
Top Prospect
Canada
49 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 10:06:42
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| glad to hear the Kaberle nonesense is finally coming to an end.. sick of hearing about him for the past 3 years in talks and then going nowhere. FInally Burkes back was against the wall and he had to trade him or lose him for nothing |
Edited by - JonPolley on 02/18/2011 10:07:10 |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 10:11:53
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Looks like the deal is in place.
To Boston - Thomas Kaberle
To Toronto - Joe Colborne, Boston's 1st round pick(not the TO pick), and a conditional pick.
Chara and Kaberle on the point for the PP = Scary. Thie Colborne kid is huge (6'5', 216 lbs), 21 yrs old and was the 16th overall pick in 2008.
Wow, Burke. You have impressed me. I must admit that I was completely wrong in Kaberle's value at the deadline or in what Burke could get for him. |
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Mario 66
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
360 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 10:14:37
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Right now Boston wins this deal but if Kaberle does what i think he will and resign with the leafs in the off season then it is a complete steal for the leafs. Time will tell.
Lemieux owns Gretzky |
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T-RAV
Top Prospect
Canada
75 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 10:25:17
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I personally would love to see Kaberle win a cup with Boston this year. That would make me very happy. He deserves it after what he has put up with in T.O.
Peace and Respect |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 11:03:15
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Boston has also traded Wheeler & Stuart to Atlanta for Peverly & Valabik.
** Wow, just checked out this kid Valabik, 6' 7" 250 LBS !!! Dman, imagine him playing next to Chara !! |
Edited by - ToXXiK1 on 02/18/2011 11:26:34 |
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nuxfan
PickupHockey All-Star
3670 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 11:07:26
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| Mario - what makes you think Kaberle will resign with the Leafs in the offseason? If he does, then this is a huge steal for Burke. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 11:25:41
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Kaberle has eluded to him being done with TO countless times. I don't see him resigning with the Leafs at all. I don't see Boston giving up what they did without a realistic shot at resigning Kaberle. Not happening.
Wow, on the other deal Boston was involved in. Good deal for both teams. Boston is the mover and shaker so far!! |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 13:50:18
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Holy Crap, is today deadline day??
Elliot to COL - Anderson to OTT
Kaberle to BOS - Colbore, a 1st rounder, and a conditional 2nd rounder to TOR
White to the Sharks - 2nd round pick to CAR
Joslin to CAR - Future Consideration to the Sharks
Wheeler and Stuart to ATL - Peverley and Valabik to BOS
and just in
Brewer to TBL - No reports who is heading to STL
Wow. I don't recall this much action so far ahead of the trade deadline. It's great for us trade starved fans.
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Sensfan101
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
500 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 14:44:56
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The trade deadline is going to be boring with all these trades before the deadline
You miss 100 percent of the shots you don't take Wayne Gretzky |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 19:36:05
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Crazy day indeed, i hope the GM's leave some deals for deadline day...
Glad to FINALLY have the Kaberle saga behind us, and looking forward to seeing him play in Boston. The Leafs got a nice return, but unlike some on here, i can't say i was surprised to see the Leafs get a 1st rounder in return...really not sure why some of you were so adament that he wouldn't be able to yield a 1st. Names like Wisniewski & Corvo were brought up as comparisons, but as i said IMO the best comparison from recent deadlines was the Brian Campbell trade from Buffalo to San Jose, which saw a 1st rounder (turned out to be Tyler Ennis) & Steve Bernier going back to Buffalo. |
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TheRC
Rookie
105 Posts |
Posted - 02/18/2011 : 19:37:49
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Yeah, I predict that deadline day will be boring. All the good stuff is happening in advance!
"If at first you don't succeed, you fail" |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2011 : 19:04:30
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Let's get some more trade discussions going. What I read today:
Larry Brooks of the NY post wrote there was interest from the Kings in Gaborik but his concussion has all but taken him off the table.
Mark Spector wrote with the Rangers no longer intersted in Souray(they had a final discussion regarding a waiver claim but chose against it) Brian McCabe is now top on their list.
Dreger on twitter said the one team that was interested in Souray(Columbus) is no longer interested.
David Pagnotta on twitter said Montreal is interested in Penner and others. Kovalev would be a last resort.
MA Godin on twitter said Montreal was making a play for Chris Stewart before the STL trade.
Steve Simmons (Toronto Sun) said a TB source was told by B Richards that his first choice would be to stay with the Stars. Other choices would be a TB return or to the Rangers. He also eluded to interest in Carolina. When asked about Toronto, apparently he said nothing but shock his head.
Rob Rossi (Pittsburgh Tribune) said a Pens source and an agent both said that Hemsky's asking price is 'huge'. Atleast a 1st round pick, a roster player, and mostly likely more. Edmonton will move him, but it will only take an overpayment.
Mark Spector wrote Philly is not sold on their goaltending.
Terry Koshan of the TO Sun wrote that Burke is interested in adding a defensemen before the deadline.
This is above the conversation about Stastny in another thread. This is shaping up to be one of the most active and meanful deadline's in recent memory. Big names on the table and rumors all around. |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2011 : 03:48:25
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With the recent trades with Dallas, does this make them sellers now? Is this an ownership issue?
What do you think of Boston making a pitch to Dallas for Richards? The 1st pick and prospects? |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2011 : 04:36:40
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I'm not sure the Bruins need another center though, unless of course they ship one to Dallas in the trade. Personally, i don't really see a fit there.
Personally i think you'll either see Richards stay in Dallas, or go to the Rangers.
And while a return to Tampa Bay would be nice, long term it's just not possible. Both Steven Stamkos & Brad Richards are going to be making huge $$ next season, and then you also have a 3rd center there with a $7.7 million cap hit in Vincent Lecavalier. As a rental perhaps if the Lightning truely believe they can win the Cup this season, but not long term unless they are able to move Vinny. |
Edited by - ryan93 on 02/22/2011 04:40:13 |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2011 : 04:56:19
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| Boston needs a franchise player now that Savard is likely finished. Rumours are abound of sending Seguin back down, if so, that's 2 centremen gone. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2011 : 06:38:08
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quote:
Originally posted by ToXXiK1
Boston needs a franchise player now that Savard is likely finished. Rumours are abound of sending Seguin back down, if so, that's 2 centremen gone.
But how could they send down the Great Seguin, who is supposed to be a top line guy that will make Burke look like an idiot?  Well, he is playing on the third line at least . . . it's a good third line though (with Ryder, Kelly now and Seguin playing RW).
I can't imagine Boston is doing any more deals this year . . . they have already made a bunch of trades, and they need time to gel as a team before the playoffs.
Would love to hear more from anyone with information on Stastny potentially getting shopped.
Could Gaborik get picked up by LA while injured still? What are the rules for this, I can't recall.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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ToXXiK1
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
696 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2011 : 06:43:56
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Seguin is getting limited ice time due to Julien not putting any faith in him. I think he's doing quite well with 21pts @ 6-10 min per game, but Julien will go with vets before giving him a shot down the stretch and into the playoffs. If his ice time is going to stay that low, he'd benefit going down. If Boston doesn't make anymore trades, i'm good with it. To many new faces can take to long to gel.
Everything i've read says Stastny's 6.6 is to expensive for anyone to take? |
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Topic |
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Trade Deadline 2011 - Predictions 
