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JERJ2008
Top Prospect
Canada
25 Posts |
 Posted - 02/21/2010 : 19:27:07
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Poll Question:
Brodeur made some big saves. His goaltending was great. His decisions about when to be a goalie and when to be the third defensemen were not. Let's hear the opinions, would having Luongo (or Fleury, for that matter) have made a difference? I think yes. He plays goal, not defense and goal. Brodeur is a huge asset with his puckhandling skills; he sets up a lot of great opportunities, made some great icings on the PK and makes teams second guess a change when he's skating out for the puck. However, we've got seven of the best defensemen in the world, and they can all do that too. Brodeur's stand-up style of play is vulnerable to tips, and two goals were on tips. Does Luongo's butterfly style and (also) top notch goaltending make him the better choice? My opinion, they're the two best in the world, and I'm happy with either one in net. Tonight, I think the score would be different had Luongo started. So, if you could replay tonights game, Canada vs USA, who would you have started?
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2010 : 19:36:39
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I think they should, and will, come back with Roberto Luongo against the Germans.
What a finish to the game though, that second last shift with the Crosby line, that was about as frantic a 90 seconds as i've ever seen, wow.
And what the heck was Corey Perry thinking on the empty net goal by Ryan Kesler??? |
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Guest2240
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Posted - 02/21/2010 : 19:55:00
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<<what was cory perry doing on the ice at that point ??
<<why not have a time-out with 1:05 left and come back with crosby, nash, iglina and thorthon up front ??
<<5 minutes left in the game and crosby has 13 :oo in ice time ??
<<Iglina scores a hat trick on with crosby/nash in game 1, game 2 badcock splits them up ??
<<scott.N and chris.P are over the hill, wheres Phaneuf and green ??
<<crosby hasnt started a powerplay in canadas last 10 ( at least ) powerplays ?? since when did marleau become more valueable to canadas powerplay than crosby ??
<<shades of gretzky and yzerman sat on the bench in canadas shootout loss to the chekzs. a few years back
<<we always seem to beat ourselves...out-coached again.
<<can some1 please tell me when perry, teows, and bergeron became better than V.lecav, St.Louis and Stamkos ??
<<getting so sick of this |
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Guest4271
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Posted - 02/21/2010 : 20:33:43
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| I said they should have started Luongo, Brodeur didn't really have a strong game verse the Swiss.........What was everyone else watching, The boneheads said it was a no brainer, and now they look like they don't know anything( that is another topic). I'd send Brodeur back to Jersey tonight, or if anything he would be in the press box, Fleury would be backing up Luongo. I feel bad for Fleury, he's not going to get a chance to play, but even he would have won tonights game. Brodeur is the reason they lost, without any doubt.........Rafalski, Parise and Langenbrunner all played or are playing with him now, coincidence I think not |
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Guest4271
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Posted - 02/21/2010 : 20:36:34
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| I'm not a Perry fan, but he played his way on this team, let the people start second guessing Stevie Y. |
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irvine
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1315 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2010 : 21:59:27
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If I could replay this game, and start a new goaltender I wouldn't.
Brodeur would get the start yet again for me. I don't think it was Brodeur solely who let this Country down.
I will agree Broduer has been over-playing the puck. If I'm Babcock, I have a talk with Marty B, privately about this. And ask him to settle it down. Play the net, not the puck.
But by games end, I'd still begin Marty as if it were games beginning. He made some great saves, and kept the score lower early on than it should have been.
Irvine/prez. |
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Canucks Man
PickupHockey Veteran
Canada
1547 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2010 : 22:52:40
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I think this question is just to hard to answer, for all we no if Luongo played he could have let in 10 goals, or he could have pitched the shutout, who knows, the bigger question is who plays the next game.
CANUCKS RULE!!!
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Axey
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
877 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2010 : 23:30:40
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2 goals were tipped, I agree he did overplay the puck alot. But even when he batted the puck out, i know for a split second everyone thought Marty was the man. Then the goal went in and it looked ridiculous, but he made some good saves. I'd go with Brodeur again if I could go back in time, also Perry was horrendous on that open net goal .. stick on the ice kid, then again he could have still been feeling the ill effects of the collision from earlier.
We could look at it like 'get Brodeur out' or that was Brodeur's one bad game he had and we wont be seeing another for a while. Look at his track record, but I do believe Luongo will face Russia. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 07:59:19
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Seriously people, did you watch the game??? Realistically, Brodeur did not have a great game. He made a glaring mistake batting the puck out of the air right to Rafalski, but out side of that he did not play that poorly.
Above all, the Canadian's outshot, outhit, out everything for the entire 60 minutes. Canada lost for 2 reasons. Firstly, the did not do we in the face off circle. Secondly, and most importantly, we just watched possibly the best goaltending display in the history of the Olympic Games.
Canada was beat by Ryan Miller.
Period.
Those who question Pronger and Niedermayer must have been watching the Russia game. They both played solid.
Corrie Perry was one of the best Canadians on the ice.
Iginla is playing hurt. He got his bell rung against the Swiss and his minutes dropped substantially after that. Furthermore, that Nash, Richards, Crosby line was awesome all night.
I don't think Canada could have won last night. Different goalie or not. Ryan Miller was outstanding and it is that simple. |
Edited by - Beans15 on 02/22/2010 12:21:18 |
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Hugh G. Rection
Rookie
165 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 09:15:46
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Beans, we all saw the game. Don't be like leafs fans and think that shot totals> everything else. First period was close, second period we dominated (although lost) and the third we looked dominant for about 3 minutes, otherwise it was a steady flow of US pp's. Miller played incredible, but even he is capable of better.
It was a tough game, because on one hand the US goals were clearly of the wierd/lucky bounce variety, but on the other, Canada didn't play well. I don't care what the stat sheet says. Pronger was a defensive abomination and was all but benched after the first period while Doughty and Keith picked up the slack. Iginla was the invisibile man, and the San Jose line likes passing way too much. Let's remember the US isn't even one of the best 4 teams in the tournament, and you can see problems. Its not too late for Canada to clean up its act, but if they keep this up Russia will send us home for the 2nd straight olympics. |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 09:26:50
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Easy - Brodeur again.
No way does he play anything less than outstanding in the replay game . . . which is why he is one of the greats.
I predict a shutout against Germany, past that? All bets are off.
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Guest2211
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Posted - 02/22/2010 : 09:30:42
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Beans 15....as for some of your comments...
>>you say brodeur didnt play that poorly ?..this isnt time for THAT POORLY...we have 3 great goalies, there cant be second chances here...if he is not done, baddock is an idiot !!
>>you say miller put on 1 of the greatest displays of goaltending all-time ( olympics ), NONSENSE. How can you give up THREE GOALS and do this ?? wheres his 50 save shutout ?? BULL, we were clearly outdone in the net, SIMPLE.
>>you say S.Nied. was great ?? did you see who out-battled him in the corner, ( nied had the puck by the way ), stole the puck which led to the 1st goal ?? an 160 pound player.
>>on the USA`s breakaway ( B,Ryan i think ), did you see who was on the ice chasing him ?? He got in behind S.Nied....
>> i played sports growing up and it seems when great players make mistakes. SOME people dont, or just dont want to see them...when i made a mistake....i should be off the team...it was HIGH-LIGHTED
>>Sure the Crosby line was great...he is the greatest player in the world...why isnt he starting our POWERPLAYS ??? What has J.Thorthon done in his career under pressure ?? NOTHING
>> Again i say Crosby had only 13:00 mins. of ice time with several mins. left in the game... |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 10:03:48
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I don't agree with the statement that both Neidermayer & Pronger had solid games, i thought both struggled by times.
Ryan Miller did have a fantastic game, especially late in the 3rd, he came up huge. That flurry where he made 3 consecutive saves on high quality shots, that was impressive. Brodeur wasn't horrible, but he wasn't spectacular either, which basically is what is required for a team to win gold in this tournament. Switch goaltenders last night (Miller for Canada, Brodeur for USA i mean), and i think we have a different outcome.
I hate to complain about a professional coach, i mean there's a reason why a guy like Babcock is a head coach in the NHL & coach of Team Canada while i have to resort to playing rec hockey & watching the Olympics from the comfort of my couch...but i do have to question a few of his choices. Firstly, IMO, Sidney Crosby has to play more. Crosby needs to be on our 1st PP unit! And i also think we need more set lines, rotate the 13th forward on the 4th line, but keep the top 3 intact, the lines have been shuffling way too much.
As for the San Jose trio, while i think Dany Heatley has been having a great Olympics so far, really neither of Joe Thornton or Patrick Marleau has done much.
Moving forward, i still have faith in this group & i think we match up well against the Russians. Bring on Germany on Tuesday!! |
Edited by - ryan93 on 02/22/2010 10:06:26 |
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Guest8332
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Posted - 02/22/2010 : 10:09:28
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quote:
Originally posted by slozo
Easy - Brodeur again.
No way does he play anything less than outstanding in the replay game . . . which is why he is one of the greats.
I predict a shutout against Germany, past that? All bets are off.
Surprised no one mentioned Doughty saving one for Marty. As Lebrun pointed out, 0.867 save percentage is not a good sign. |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 12:26:50
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Hey Guys, hindsight is ALWAYS 20/20. Everyone can say all they want about what they would have, could have, should have done.
If you don't think that Miller absolutely stole that game I don't really know what to say.
And to Mr. Hugh, I agree that the first 1/2 of the 3rd period was all US PP. That is why I said "1/2 of the 3rd period". From about the 11 minute mark of the 3rd, I don't think it was out of the US zone for more than a couple of minutes.
As far as the guest?? I would bet my life that I could go back and show more than one mistake by every single player on the ice last night. What's your point?? Canada outplayed the US, hands down no doubt. Difference of the game was one mistake cost Brodeur immediately, and Miller stood on his head.
How is that Babcock's fault?? |
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Guest2000
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Posted - 02/22/2010 : 12:27:08
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Seriously Slozo & Irvine Were you both together last night pounding back some bourbon and tequila? I would play with 6 guys and a open net an doughty as my last guy back (100 save percentage lmao) lets see 6 guys on that would mean canada would of had about 60 shots so lets give them 6 goals. Doughty or someone would of only had to make between 16 - 20 saves or blocks and we win the game i like my odds over letting brodeur touch the ice again. Seriously you want a guy who minus the wins (he plays 25 more games then any other goalie but kiprosoff that's why the two of them are usually near the top of wins has done nothing but blow big games for his team and country for the last 5 years. You must be anti Canadian or just love to stir the pot cuz thats like saying if i could go back to 98 i'd leave gretzky and yzerman on the bench and still shoot shanahan and that big F****** dummy lindros in the shoot out. First Brodeur was horrible he made two saves that you could classify as momentum stoppers and gave up four goals that we in the correct state of mind call back breakers or in your guys drunken state (gut rot). He was brutal and has been brutal in every big game he has played in since the 06 Olympics case and point two goals to carolina in the playoffs in the last 20 secs to cost his team the lead and eliminate the devils and now 6 goals allowed on under 40 shots against two sub-par teams that wont even end up in the medal rounds. Ya i said it the US is sub par they have a great goalie and a quick talented group of forwards but against any of the top 5 they lose and lose convincingly as they should of last night as Canada steam rolled them for 50 of the 60 minutes of the game and for those 10 mins brodeur was practicing his baseball game and showing the world how well he can imitate a fish out of water. You know where those type of stats lead a goalie in the real world even with brodeurs history a nice seat beside cujo just like in 02. The only thing Canada got dominated in was face-offs but beyond that had brodeur stayed in his net and played a bad game they still would of won 3 - 2 but instead he plays like a Douche Bag. Seriously call up our goalie from our national paraolympic team who's a beast back there and we know he's going to stay in the net. If brodeur plays another game in this tournament Canada will end up 12th and the 7th in Torino will look like gold and if he's in net i'd rather watch the swiss norway game again then go through another brodeur performance. I guess i could get really drunk so his brutal 10 save 7 goal performance looks incredible or i can think Andre "Red light" Rasicoe is between the pipes and every save is a bonus. Also i wish babcock wasn't so pro west. Anybody who wants to debate that can try and explain why corey perry is on the ice with 1 min left. The sharks and ducks forwards are always out there and then you got Crosby Richards and Staal who were the best forwards last night along with toews and nash playing between 10 and 15 min. The rest of the way i play with 9 forwards 5d (F*** Niedemayer and Pronger they have been just as useless as brodeur - Niedemayer spent more time in the US end last night then he did his own) and ride luongo or fluery the rest of the way. I didn't want brodeur to play last night but the fact that people would still play him again after the consistent failure he has been the last 5 years kind of upsets me in where the knowledge of the sport is headed here in Canada. He may hold all the records but we are ignorant to believe that brodeur is the goalie he was in 02. Fleury has been to two straight cups and some of you will wanna make the argument look at how stacked the pens are. So two players maybe three make team Canada from the pens (Crosby, malkin gonchar) and yes i realize the last two are Russian but i am stating they are good enough to play on a team of canada's caliber. So if fleury can carry a team with three Canadian worthy players how can you not agree that he couldn't carry 25 Canadian stars? And luongo is just luongo a guy who is huge in the net at 6'3 or 4 and knows how to use his size. If anybody has any influence on team canada call up the people you know and have them burn brodeurs equipment because with him in net are chances are as good as china beating our woman's team.
Go Canada & Take on your American Citizenship Brodeur |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 12:48:54
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Was the Babcock comment directed towards me? If so then by no means was the loss Babcocks fault, i just didn't agree with some of his decisions is all.
I entirely agree with you in that Canada outplayed the US last night, and Ryan Miller stole the game for his country, especially late in the 3rd he was sensational. |
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tbar
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
376 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 12:51:05
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First off my vote goes to any Canadian goaltender that plays in the NHL other then Broduer could have got that win last night. Luongo should start the rest of the way. Slozo said Broduer will be stellar in the next one (I do agree that he probably would be) he also stated that the bets are off after that and thats where I get worried again. lets go With Louie the rest of the way and if he looks bad at the start of any game he has a short leash and we pull him.
As far as lines go the Shark line probably got the most chances last night for all of you who are wanting them split up. Iginla needs to be with Crosby and Nash full Time.
Crosby not starting one powerplay....who cares who starts the powerplay because he gets the 2nd half anyway also theyre is a better chance he will et tired pk's or the 2nd unit which is an advantage.
Corry Perry and anybody else willing to be that lazy wearing a team Canada Jersey needs a baseball ba of the knees when he leaves the rink. I cant stand lazy hockey plays theyre is no worse way then that to have US lock up the victory against us, just frickin brutal. |
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Guest2000
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Posted - 02/22/2010 : 13:06:11
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| Per mins played the line of toews iginla and morrow sometimes bergeon had the most chances and overall crosby had by far the most opportunities. I definitely get what your saying with crosby playing the second half of the power play but why would you not give your best player a minute and a half of open space to either shoot or move the puck to an open guy as oppose to the last 30 in which you try to force stuff as you know the player is about to head out of the box. I Definitely dont agree with splitting the shark line up but what have marleau and thorton done in the clutch besides choke to deserve the most icetime when you got guys like crosby nash and staal who can dominate the game on their own if need be. |
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Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro
735 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 14:38:54
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Ok Beans we all agree that Miller played a great game and stole this one. The point is not about that it's about your comment that Miller had the greatest performance in all of the goalies at the Olympics. Ok here's a couple in our time. Hasek in 98, 2-1 win in shoutout vs Canada in the semifinal and 1-0 win over Russia in the final. Gerber 50 plus saves shutout in 2006 against Canada. And I'm sure there was many other great performances. The point is that if you score 3 goals against a hot goalie and you only let around 20 shots against, you should win the game.
Also about Perry, he did have the slash penalty that turn into the game winning goal, and his play at the last minute just showed he was just not working hard at all. And he hasn't done much on the score sheet either. How can this guy be the best canadian player on the ice last night?
Niedermayer is getting beated over and over again in the corners, he's skilled dont get me wrong but everybody seems to outplay him even the swiss. Pronger made many turnovers, and I would add Boyle to this list of creating turnovers.
And the topic is about IF we could go back and look at the goals that went in. Would it have go in against Luongo??? I don't think so because his size and his butterfly style would have stopped the 3rd goal and maybe the first one, and the second and the fourth could have been avoided if the goalie wouldn't try too much to do everything by himself (but really I don't blame Brodeur to try to do everything because everytime the puck goes in the corner the other team comes out with it).
Brodeur is really good and he made some really good saves last night and he stood on his head against the swiss team, but his style of play, wasn't what Canada needed last night, and I think this is what the topic is about.
So I say Luongo should get the nod from now on because the way Canada plays. The other teams doesn't get many chances so they will crash the net and put the puck on the net every chance they have, therefore having a big goalie with a butterfly could really help a team who's outshooting the other teams. |
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Guest4803
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Posted - 02/22/2010 : 14:51:55
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| brodeur didnt play like a world class goalie last night or yet in the tournament. Glad to see Lou is in net vs germany. What our team is missing is the same thing it was missing in Turin, Scoring from our Defense. WHERE ARE YOU MIKE GREEN? |
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Guest6233
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Posted - 02/22/2010 : 14:59:39
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| Yea me and my friend were talking before the game and saying Lo should start |
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ryan93
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
996 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 15:06:48
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Even without Mike Green though, you wouldn't think scoring from our defense should be an issue. Duncan Keith is the 2nd highest scoring defensemen in the NHL this year. Dan Boyle & Drew Doughty are both tied for 4th, Chris Pronger is 6th, Scott Niedermayer is 9th, Shea Weber is 11th.
So we have 6 of the top 11 defensemen in terms of scoring this season, no other country can even come close to the kind of offensive defensemen that we pocess. And if your talking purely in terms of goals scored...well Keith, Boyle, Doughty, & Weber are all tied for 2nd in the NHL. |
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Guest9173
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Posted - 02/22/2010 : 16:51:39
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| I'll tell ya what, If we lose these Olympics (no GOLD) it will be squarely on Stevie Y's back.......Ya gotta question some of the choices that were made.......For me personaly the biggest mistake.... Why Pronger?? Over the youth and SPEED of Green or Phaneuf....... Pronger has cost us more with his lack of mobility than Brodeur's fish out of water style...... Please Hockey Canada no more former players as GM's.....We have to pick a team based on pure skill not on how players played for Canada in the past......... |
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Guest6383
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Posted - 02/22/2010 : 16:59:02
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| Well said Leafs81, couldn't agree with you more. This is what the topic IS about, would the game have been different if Luongo was in net. |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 18:14:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest6383
Well said Leafs81, couldn't agree with you more. This is what the topic IS about, would the game have been different if Luongo was in net.
The problem with this question is basically there's no way to tell if we'd have won. It's like someone mentioned, Luongo might have given up 10? Here's the thing, of all you guys saying Luongo should have started, we you really saying this before the game? I don't recall seeing a whole lot of people claiming Luongo should have been starting yesterdays game, yet now it's real easy to say "we shoulda.....". I did see Beans say he didn't think Brodeur look comfortable vs the Swiss but still don't recall him saying Luongo or MAF for that matter should have started?
Here's my take, and i'm sure i'll get a lot of grief for it, but i'd stick with Brodeur at this point. When's the last time he had two bad outtings in a row? I just doesn't happen! Germany gives him a chance to get his head back in it, get his game together and would be somewhat of a tune up for the Russia game!
I'm fine with Bobby Lu from here on out, but i wouldn't be making that decision personally.
Here's my biggest beef. What do you notice when you compare our juniors at the WJC to the NHLers in the Olympics? Teams are afraid to play our juniors cuz they know they're gonna take a phyiscal pounding! Our olympians don't seem to wanna throw their weight around? It's to the point where i wish Lucic was our 13th forward!!! Everytime i watch the junior team play, i count how long before someone throws a massive hit! It's usually on the first shift! I just don't see the physical play enough. Yeah, Nash's been doing it a bit, but they should all be doing it more!
Lastly, i agree, we should have taken a timeout and gotten Crosby and Nash back out there, but before you throw Perry under the bus, give Kesler some credit. He made a pretty darn good play to seal the deal for the US..... |
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Leafs81
PickupHockey Pro
735 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 19:10:42
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Nah Alex, I'm not saying we should of, because I'm a big Brodeur fan and I was saying he should play for the whole tournament.
I'm saying I think Luongo would of fit better the style Canada plays by just cutting down the angles and not giving a whole lot of net to the opposition.
Now I say Luongo should play because I watch all three games and I think this is what would be better for Canada. Like you said most of us were giving the nod to Brodeur vs the US. But in a short tournament like this a lot can happen in 1 game.
Luongo never proved to be a winner in his whole career... now it's his chance.
At least we all agree on one thing... GO CANADA!!!!! |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 21:16:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest9173
I'll tell ya what, If we lose these Olympics (no GOLD) it will be squarely on Stevie Y's back.......Ya gotta question some of the choices that were made.......For me personaly the biggest mistake.... Why Pronger?? Over the youth and SPEED of Green or Phaneuf....... Pronger has cost us more with his lack of mobility than Brodeur's fish out of water style...... Please Hockey Canada no more former players as GM's.....We have to pick a team based on pure skill not on how players played for Canada in the past.........
People are talking about Pronger and his negative play defensively and then bring up Green and Phafeuf?? That is the biggest joke ever.
No Skill?? Who was that out there generating what the opposition coach called "2-1 scoring chances??"
Mike Green or Dion Phaneuf on the ice last night and the result is the same. Miller still stands on this head and stops all those shots.
Here's the b est thing about this. If Canada plays a garbage game yesterday and ekks out a win, 90% of these posts don't happen. But they play an amazing game and get shut down by a brilliant goal keeper and a disciplined US team and they get lamb basted and everyone becomes all negative.
If Canada plays like the did last night, they will be fine. If Canada finds a way to come all the way through Germany, Russia, most likely Sweden, and then beat the US or Fins in the Final, then Stevie Y will all of a sudden become the best Olympic GM ever! Babcock would be ready for the HOF for putting in Luongo, and Pronger might even become a God if he was to have a hand in the winning goal.
Hero's or Goat's, nothing in between.
And to Leafs81, I watched all three games that you speak of (Hasek in 98, Gerber in 06, and Last Night) and I still say that Miller's performance was the best Olympic goaltending display I have ever watched. I could care less about the scores, shots, or any other stats. Few times in a generation is a time where a goalie's will wins the game. Some of the best goalie performances I have watched have not been in low scoring games. It's about a goalie needing to not let in another puck to win and then doing it. Watching the other team do things that would score on 99% of the rest of the goalies in the world but they can't beat that guy that night.
Last night that was Ryan Miller. |
Edited by - Beans15 on 02/22/2010 21:24:48 |
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Guest4271
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Posted - 02/22/2010 : 21:30:39
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| Brodeur is out of gas, Lou Lamorello, made sure of that, only hasn't started 2 or 3 games this year.....coincidence, not, Lou knew Canada was in their pool. Hope Loungo starts, because if he doesn't I will not watch |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 22:02:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest4271
Brodeur is out of gas, Lou Lamorello, made sure of that, only hasn't started 2 or 3 games this year.....coincidence, not, Lou knew Canada was in their pool. Hope Loungo starts, because if he doesn't I will not watch
Lou Lamoriello has a regular job to do that is his first priority. If your back up goalie was Yann Danis, you would play Brodeur in 58 games too!!
You show'em champ!! Turn that channel if Brodeur's in net. That's learn'em!! |
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polishexpress
PickupHockey Pro
525 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 22:20:45
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First off, great icon Beans! Second, sorry if I repeat anything from above. When guests start writing essays and dissertations, you know it's a hot topic.
Honestly, Beans hit the nail on the head: MILLER WON THE GAME FOR THE USA
What do you expect from Canada? A few practices and 2 games, and they are to be in peak form? For Canada to win Gold, they need to peak by the elimination games, not in round robin play!!!
Everyone needs to chill, enjoy the hockey. How often do you get to see the best in the world altogether? Enjoy Olympic hockey as a hockey fan and you won't get an aneurysm or a heart attack. It's difficult, I know. For example, watching the Slovaks upset the Russians in the shootout as a neutral party was beautiful! |
Edited by - polishexpress on 02/22/2010 22:22:11 |
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Alex116
PickupHockey Legend
6113 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2010 : 23:29:31
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Well said polish....
I'm enjoying the games, i can tell you that for sure! I was fortunate enough to be at the Czech / Russia game yesterday and it was epic! The hit that Ovie hammered Jagr with was a game changer! The game was played at an amazing pace and the crowd was really into it! Also went to the Swe/Fin game last night but it didn't live up to the hype. Maybe i was still fuming over the Canada loss but it just wasn't all that entertaining?
Hopefully we get a convincing win vs the Germans tomorrow and use the momentum to our advantage and show up with something special for the Russians on Wednesday!!! |
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Guest4271
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Posted - 02/23/2010 : 00:57:52
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| Say what you will Beans, the last 3 weeks before the Olympics proves Brodeur is running low. 3 wins in last 10 or something similar, one goalie can't play 99% of games and still have something left, as for not watching I would still watch, but then if the struggles con't, then the rest of you people would start in on what went wrong and how you would have fixed everything. Won't happen as LUONGO gets the start, and I would put Fleury as the backup |
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Guest0965
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Posted - 02/23/2010 : 02:12:32
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if luongo gets the win against the germans, brodeur will start against the russians, then luongo gets the start on friday against sweden or slovakia if we advance.
then finally on sunday, it could be a split decision...luongo or marty... vs USA (most likely), Finland or the Czechs
IF Canada does face USA, i will go nuts downtown.......all out!! |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2010 : 07:10:42
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I disagree that the goalies will rotate. Luongo will go the rest of the way. The only way that Brodeur will see any more ice is if Luongo craps the bed early and gets the hook.
2ndly, I am not arguing that Brodeur is "out of gas." I am arguing that Lou Lamoriello did that intentionally to tire him. Marty has played 70+ games for the past 10 seasons. Maybe it has caught up on him, but Lou Lamoriello did not overplay Broduer so the US would beat Canada.
Finally, on a side note, a good friend of mine got tickets way back to a Quarter Final Game. He never imagined that game would turn out to potentially be Russia vs. Canada.
What a jerk!!! |
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n/a
deleted
4809 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2010 : 07:55:09
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Ok, Beans . . . you will have to explain to me, someone who did not watch the game between the US and Canada (I was on a plane home watching bad movies):
How can ANY Olympic goaltending performance have been better than Hasek's two victories over Canada and Russia to win the gold medal?
This was not an elimination round game, and had no significance other than seeding. Miller played great? Are Canada's forwards THAT much more stacked than 98 that we can score three goals against him? THAT'S the performance of a lifetime?!?
I am sure Miller had a great game, from all accounts he stopped many good shots and chances . . . but how it can be put up there with games that have real meaning, with less goals allowed and more chances against?
Don't give Miller too much credit!
"Take off, eh?" - Bob and Doug |
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2010 : 10:22:39
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Well Slozo, this is where we disagree. Just because the latest Canada/US game was not a knock out or medal round game does not diminish the game that Miller had in my opinion. I do see the point that Hasak's games did mean more than this last one, but the performance is the same, regardless of the game.
Miller single handledly beat the best Canada has been and possible can be offensively. That is HUGE.
Perhaps I am giving Miller too much credit on the grand scale. However, no one has disagreed that he won that game for the US. |
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Matt_Roberts85
PickupHockey Pro
Canada
936 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2010 : 11:05:14
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Have to agree with beans, Miller won them the game no doubt.
Brodeur made 2 or 3 critical errors that cost team canada goals, but still made enough saves (some of them big) to keep the team in the game. Miller robbed canada big time and he deserves to be praised for his efforts more than blame needs to be placed at brodeurs feet.
Luongo will run with the ball the rest of the way and win gold.
There is no "I" in team, but there is an "M" and an "E". |
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Guest2000
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Posted - 02/23/2010 : 11:09:45
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Sorry Beans normally you bring up solid points and i completely agree but miller did not steal that game from canada brodeur did. Had he stayed in his net and played a bad game canada still would of won but he was all over the place and down right awful, the worst goaltending performance i've seen in his entire career. Even in games where he gave up 5 and 6 goals he was hung out to dry on some of them and made big saves to keep it at 6 goals; the game against the US he did everything he could do to lose that game and the worst part of it was his devil teammates or past teammates where his kryptonite. I'm sure he feels like s*** but sorry you gotta give him the same treatment they gave cujo back in 02. Also Hiller played a better game against canada then did miller with no d infront of him so that also throws out your best performance ever comment.
Seriously though how can anyone still stay they want brodeur to play against Russia little own play at all. He hasn't looked good in either appearance he has been brutal the last couple weeks prior to the olympics if you wanted to give marty his last hurah you would play him against the germans where even if he let in 6 even though he wouldn't he'd still leave with a W but with the state of mind he is in now you'd be foolish to through him to the sharks that are the Russian snippers and the top lines on any of the other big 5. Goaltending is all about confidence and seeing the puck and normally it looks like a football coming at brodeur but lately it looks like a golf ball coming off the club of tiger woods and every shot looks headed for the promise land. He's the best but i've never liked his style even though it has obviously worked for him.
I said on many occasions i didn't want him in net against the US or any of the other powerhouses just because i feel his stand up style leaves to many holes for all the stars these teams come at you with and lately almost every shot along the ice is beating him which never happended in the past. Regardless of what the coaches decide for brodeurs sake and ours as a nation i hope he doesn't play beyond today's game if they allow him to play the second half of the game just to pick up his moral. Even with Luongo in net there is no guarntee hockey is a game of bounces and unless canada starts to show more heart which is what our country is known for and what keslers clinching goal was all about then no matter how much skill we have we wont compete with the close knit groups like the swedes and fins.
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Beans15
Moderator
Canada
8286 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2010 : 11:23:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Guest2000
Sorry Beans normally you bring up solid points and i completely agree but miller did not steal that game from canada brodeur did. Had he stayed in his net and played a bad game canada still would of won but he was all over the place and down right awful, the worst goaltending performance i've seen in his entire career. Even in games where he gave up 5 and 6 goals he was hung out to dry on some of them and made big saves to keep it at 6 goals; the game against the US he did everything he could do to lose that game and the worst part of it was his devil teammates or past teammates where his kryptonite. I'm sure he feels like s*** but sorry you gotta give him the same treatment they gave cujo back in 02. Also Hiller played a better game against canada then did miller with no d infront of him so that also throws out your best performance ever comment.
How did Broduer impact the 40+ saves that Miller made against the best offensive players Canada has today??
Simply because a statement is made that Hillar was better does not mean it's true. The Swiss played very strong defensively against the US, the Canadians, and the Norwegians. They played great team defense and to say that Hiller did it without anyone is a little shortsighted in my opinion. I also believe that if Miller was Swiss, Canada would not have scored a single goal that game.
As far as Brodeur, I agree not his besdt game. I completely agree that the Roloson-esque 'baseball swing' play was complete garbage. But, it's hard to pin the 2 deflection goals and the empty netter against him. 2 were his fault, the other 3 were not. For that, I say that the team in front of Broduer were just as guilty for the lose as he was.
But we may have to agree to disagree on this one. I think we can agree that the result was very disappointing.  |
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Guest2000
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Posted - 02/23/2010 : 12:09:09
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(Beans) How did Broduer impact the 40+ saves that Miller made against the best offensive players Canada has today??
Simply because a statement is made that Hillar was better does not mean it's true. The Swiss played very strong defensively against the US, the Canadians, and the Norwegians. They played great team defense and to say that Hiller did it without anyone is a little shortsighted in my opinion. I also believe that if Miller was Swiss, Canada would not have scored a single goal that game.
No statements are not always correct however 44 saves is better then 41 is it not? stats are not always correct either but seriously if miller plays for switzerland canada doesn't score you cant be serious? I've seen miller play better this season little own his career maybe the win was a career defining moment as far as who it was against and what was at stake but you cant believe that if brodeur stays in his net instead of trying to make so many plays canada doesn't win that game. Also the last crosby goal was soft and the save on Iginla towards the end was simply because iginla didn't have his head up otherwise he would of realized the entire upper half of the net was open.
As for the goals brodeur was at fault on know you cant blame him on the empty net but even on both deflections he gave the puck away on the first one and the second deflection he was spread further then a cheerleader at a post game party. Even if it didn't get tipped i think it was going straight in for Rafalski's hat trick.
So ya we obviously wont agree on all but i do agree that if canada doesn't show more heart and doesn't stop turning the puck over they are history i guess they still fail to realize that everyone is gunning to beat them and prove their not the best that we think they are. |
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Luongo or Brodeur, different score vs USA? 
